# Pioneer Upgrade Replacement



## iKermit (Dec 13, 2010)

In before XtremeRevolution.


----------



## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

RoadRage said:


> It is what it is....The car came with the upgraded radio (got a good deal on the car), sunroof, RS and all minus the leather interior. No big deal, however the Pioneer unit could use a lot more balance and ummmf. I was wondering if it would be counter-productive to replace the speakers with better Pioneers?
> 
> For example, the rear 6x9's with Pioneer TS-D6902R 2 way speakers, rear door speakers with TS-A1604C components, and the front doors with TS-A1684R 4-way speakers. Would I be able to notice the difference? The stock speakers are all paper-cone Pioneers that lack drive. Input please.
> 
> PS I want to keep the "Pioneer" theme but replace them with better offerings from the parent company.


There is no point in keeping the "Pioneer" theme, especially when most of their speakers are on the lower end of the quality and performance spectrum and would be installed behind grills and never be seen. Keep in mind that you will also need to purchase speaker brackets to install any aftermarket speakers. 

That said, the rear speakers are subwoofers and will not be playing any material above maybe 200hz, so going with a 2-way in the back would be counter-productive. If you want more bass, don't even spend money on 6x9s and get a dedicated subwoofer, even if it's a single 8". The fact that it will be inside an enclosure will vastly improve your low frequency extension. 

One thing paper cones have over composites or metal cones is efficiency, which is a bit important when you have lower power handling like you do. Some of the nicest speakers I've used are paper cones (Aurasound NS6 comes to mind), so don't be so quick to assume they're trash. They are particularly good at reproducing natural instruments like guitars, as well as vocals. You'll discover a few things if you "upgrade" your speakers. The first is that they'll be underpowered. They won't be as loud, which will require a higher volume, and a higher distortion as a result. The second is that you'll throw off the balance of the system badly and move the sound stage rearward. Those 4-ways you have planned for the front will cause all sorts of frequency response issues with the tweeters that are currently in the pillars. It will just sound...off. The rear speakers currently don't produce many high frequency notes, and causing them to play it will make music sound a bit more unnatural. 

If you're looking for an "in the club" feel, you might achieve that with what you're looking for, but you're going to run into some problems actually making it sound good, especially without aftermarket amplification. 

Before proceeding, I would advise that you think about what exactly is missing from your system. Is it a depth in bass output? Is it a depth in midbass (lower male vocals, etc.) clarity? Is it a harshness in the tweeters? If you can at least find a general aspect that you find lacking in this system, you can take a step toward solving the problem. You can't always just throw better parts at a problem and expect to fix it.


----------



## RoadRage (May 19, 2012)

I do plan on contacting you for stealth-box for the rear when ready. I guess whats missing would be overall balance between a nice mid-bass punchy response, a little more clarity on the highs, deep response on the lows (your box will rectify that) and thats it pretty much. I know Pioneer is on the low-end, I gave my vehicle of 5 years to my wife (which had JL Audio TR650-CXi all around which sounded great) and I greatly miss the sound I had.


----------



## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

RoadRage said:


> I do plan on contacting you for stealth-box for the rear when ready. I guess whats missing would be overall balance between a nice mid-bass punchy response, a little more clarity on the highs, deep response on the lows (your box will rectify that) and thats it pretty much. I know Pioneer is on the low-end, I gave my vehicle of 5 years to my wife (which had JL Audio TR650-CXi all around which sounded great) and I greatly miss the sound I had.


Here's the advice I can give you if you want some great sound on a budget. 

If you can spend $250 on "speakers" to get midbass, mids, and highs, and are willing to learn something new (not being a snob, just saying), then grab a MiniDSP, some Dayton DA-175s, some 1" Vifa Waveguide tweeters, a beefy 4-channel amp, some sound deadening from SDS and prepare to have your mind blown.

If you don't want to drop that kind of cash, grab this component set, a good 2-channel amp, and some SDS sound deadening. 
Image Dynamics CTX-6.5cs (CTX 65 CS) 6.5" CTX Component Speakers

The stealth box will be for those who need space and stealth above all else, disregarding optimal extension and output. I'll be honest, flush mount subs will not sound quite as good as their conventional counterparts, but if you want to pack a punch in that little cavity, your options are few. You'd be much better served if you could fit a 10" deep x 16" tall x 16" wide box in the trunk behind the seats. It won't look the same, but it will sound better and _vastly _increase your subwoofer options. 

Leave the rear door speakers and deck 6x9s alone; they won't do a whole lot to improve the sound you're looking for, which is going to be directly in front of you.


----------



## RoadRage (May 19, 2012)

Sounds good xtreme...I took notes and will keep them on file for the replacement.


----------



## tecollins1 (Nov 6, 2011)

Though I don't have the pioneer system... I have gone with amplifying the front speakers and bought the CTX as described above and deadened the doors. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6rmrpgqeUR0&feature=youtube_gdata_player

As of right now I have the tweeters in with the crossover and the stock speakers, and I'll tell you it's pretty loud now. But the stock fronts can't handle bass when amplified. 

X's brackets should be in tomorrow so I can install the 6-1/2's then. I'll let you know how it is.


Sent from iPhone 4


----------



## RoadRage (May 19, 2012)

Has anyone listened to the system in the Buick Verano? They are using the same 9-speaker setup and am wondering how different the Bose system would be? Will have to wait until 2012 model parts are available at gmpartsshop.com, also for those wanting an upgrade to the "dot-matrix" display, the Verano unit looks good and may be a nice upgrade. Wondering if the instrument cluster is swapable also?


----------



## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

RoadRage said:


> Has anyone listened to the system in the Buick Verano? They are using the same 9-speaker setup and am wondering how different the Bose system would be? Will have to wait until 2012 model parts are available at gmpartsshop.com, also for those wanting an upgrade to the "dot-matrix" display, the Verano unit looks good and may be a nice upgrade. Wondering if the instrument cluster is swapable also?


I wouldn't spend the money to get the BOSE counterparts if that's what you're asking, nor would I recommend it to anyone else. BOSE is one of the worst speaker makers out there. "No highs, no lows? Must be a ____."

I'll take a Pioneer system over a BOSE system any day.


----------



## Michel1980 (Jul 24, 2014)

Paper cones are actually the best you can have, simple reason that it vibrates with ease. Which in return, does not need lots of power input, for instance kevlar or aluminum cones have more mass (relative) the need more power. However, it will produce a tighter mid range this is all pending on what kind of speakers you choose. 

Just do not think for a moment, that paper cones are crap. If i could i would build what i have build in my living room (electrostatic speakers) and put that in my car. Will blow any "high end" system out of the water with a decent dedicated sub. But that is fairly impossible having ESL's in a car.


----------

