# 14 Cruze Knocking



## BDCCruze (Jul 12, 2017)

Guys, 14 Cruze TD 80k miles

I'm getting a knocking sound while I'm turning sharply, but it is only when there is a lot of downward force.

So, if I go into a parking lot I can do circles all day and not hear it. But when I jump onto the expressway, going up a sharp semicircle ramp putting a lot of downward force into the left front wheel while turning right, it knocks very gently.

The knock is not fast, maybe 4 times per second. I know a bad CV shaft knocks but wouldn't it be faster than that considering the RPM at 40 MPH?


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

Wheel bearing perhaps?


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## BDCCruze (Jul 12, 2017)

I wanted to update this.

It's not knocking only while turning, it knocks even going strait and braking hard. So I'm really looking at strictly a brake issue and not suspension or drive train. Thing is, it doesn't do it all the time and it depends how hard I brake. Harder braking makes it happen more frequently but if I'm braking under normal conditions I almost never hear it.

I'm trying to come up with a list of things to check when I look at it again. I have dealt with loose abutment clips cause rattling sounds, but not knocking.

Right now my plan is to disassemble the front brakes, clean everything up, regrease the mounting surfaces with brake grease and clean and relubricate the guide pins with silicon, then reassemble.


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## ChevyGuy (Dec 13, 2014)

I'd add inspect the inner and outer CV boots to the list. Since the CV turns at the same speed as the wheel for a front-wheel drive car, I don't know as the speed of the clicks is a clue.

I'd also inspect the tires. Make sure there isn't a rock or something in the tread that's not coming into contact with the roadway when under more force.


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## blackbird (Nov 6, 2017)

Sounds like a good plan. When it starts making the noise, does it change if you were to tap the brakes or continue to accelerate with right foot and apply some brake with left foot?

While you're working and have it on jack stands check the wheel bearings for play and when you have it apart be sure to check all the suspension bushings, axles, etc. and possibly re-torque everything.


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## BDCCruze (Jul 12, 2017)

Quick update.

I pulled apart, cleaned, and lubricated all contact points on the front and rear. The noise is still present. It doesn't seem to have changed at all.

One thing I noticed is the inside of the front rotors had strange pad imprints all around. Not sure how to describe it. Sorta looks like this https://mechanics.stackexchange.com/questions/7213/is-this-a-warped-rotor

I'm wondering if that front pads are grabbing to much and knocking around within the caliper as they grab and release. Maybe I should have the front rotors machined, just skimmed? The pads look brand new (I do almost exclusive highway driving) and the rotors have barely an indent where the pads touch, so they have plenty of meat left.

Another thing is, I did the rear a separate day than the front. One thing I forgot to do on the front is lubricate the back side of the brake clips. I only lubricated the ears on the pads, and cleaned the clips and bracket, but didn't lube the back side as I put the clips back in. I read somewhere you are supposed to do that. If I turn the front rotors I'll do that.



ChevyGuy said:


> I'd add inspect the inner and outer CV boots to the list. Since the CV turns at the same speed as the wheel for a front-wheel drive car, I don't know as the speed of the clicks is a clue.


At first I thought it could be a CV joint. But the knocking now occurs while going strait and braking. I've also done circles in parking lot and not been able to reproduce the sound. Plus, it never knocks except when braking so it must be braking related.



blackbird said:


> Sounds like a good plan. When it starts making the noise, does it change if you were to tap the brakes or continue to accelerate with right foot and apply some brake with left foot?
> 
> While you're working and have it on jack stands check the wheel bearings for play and when you have it apart be sure to check all the suspension bushings, axles, etc. and possibly re-torque everything.


The knocking sound doesn't seem to change, it just starts knocking then stops a moment after I lift off the brakes.


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## Taxman (Aug 10, 2017)

How are your sway bar end links?
They started knocking over bumps in my Saturn (Cobalt) last fall, and they're doing it like mad now. 
Gotta remember to buy new links. I can feel the play if I grab one and wiggle it.


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## ChevyGuy (Dec 13, 2014)

BDCCruze said:


> it never knocks except when braking so it must be braking related.


Maybe. Frequently, brake related noise goes away during braking since that's when everything is clamped down.

The noise might be cause by the slight weight shift, or pulling the front wheels to the rear.


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## 14'ecocruze (Nov 18, 2016)

Can you record the sound so we can hear it?


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## BDCCruze (Jul 12, 2017)

blackbird said:


> When it starts making the noise, does it change if you were to tap the brakes or continue to accelerate with right foot and apply some brake with left foot?


Just to update you again. I listened closely again today. It goes away when the car is still moving, but at slow speeds around 5mph or less. But slowing from 30mph to around 5 it's very noticeable and decreases as you slow down, so it's something rotating for sure.



ChevyGuy said:


> Maybe. Frequently, brake related noise goes away during braking since that's when everything is clamped down.
> 
> The noise might be cause by the slight weight shift, or pulling the front wheels to the rear.


Yeah, at first I could only hear it while turning right sharply on one specific freeway onramp I take. Now it does it while braking in a straight line, even then, weight is shifting to the front.

I did also go around and push back the dust shields all the way around, since I had tires put on last December with thoughts they might have bent one in, still no better. But thinking of tires, could that be causing it? I had them put on in December, but didn't start hearing the noise until around mid-March.

For those suggesting CV joint, I did check all the boots. Nothing is ripped or leaking, so if there is damage it was not caused by water or contamination. The car is at 85,000 miles so I still have a bit of life left in the power train warranty, which includes drive axles I believe. Guess I could take it in, but I'm afraid the dealer is going to say it's brakes first, then after that doesn't fix it "find" the warranty work.

My next plan of attack is to remove the rotors and mark them which side they were on, then have them turned. Then replace them on the opposite side, as well as the pads, and flip the pads from inside to outside. If i completely reverse everything and it still makes no difference then I can look at more suspension or drive train issues.


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## ChevyGuy (Dec 13, 2014)

A couple of quick ideas - double check that the lug nuts are not coming loose. Second, if there's any trim (hubcaps, wheel covers, wheel rings, etc.) remove them. You'd be amazed at what kinds of sounds those things can make.


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## BDCCruze (Jul 12, 2017)

Another update.

Today I was taking a different way home. I was coasting down an on ramp (one I don't normally take, this one you coast down) and noticed the knocking while turning right, even though I wasn't braking. I hit the accelerator and the knocking went away, lift off the gas, came back, hit the gas again went away.

Noise 1 is from the front left wheel area in a parking lot idling forward, turn the wheel slightly right and back straight several times. Around the 3 second mark you can kind of hear a cooing sound, like a dove. It's quiet in the audio but very noticeable while testing it.

Noise 2 is the knocking, but it's really hard to tell. I could only get the car to do it once today. Between the 2-3 second mark you can hear it for a brief moment.


Noise 1 - https://ufile.io/v2rt7
Noise 2 - https://ufile.io/34km1


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## BDCCruze (Jul 12, 2017)

Another file from today. You can hear it around the 7 second mark for around 3-4 seconds.

https://ufile.io/08q9d


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## blackbird (Nov 6, 2017)

I think I can sort-of hear what sounds like a rotating rattle/clunk decreasing in frequency as you're slowing. If it's now doing it while coasting and off the brakes, but goes away when you accelerate slightly that would have me ruling out or at least suspecting something else before the brakes. I guess it's possible a pad is binding up if the knuckle and caliper mounting bracket flexed under load could cause _maybe_ cause interference but not very likely with that type of sound and what you've previously described.

Did you ever check the wheel bearings for play? If the car safely on jack stands and with a floor jack under the car as a safety backup, grabbing the top and bottom of the tire and pulling in-out while the steering wheel is locked can sometimes show if there's play when it gets bad enough. (This is the only time you should ever put your hand between the bottom of the tire and the road/ground and even then be extremely careful the car doesn't fall.)

That or the sway bar end links possibly loading and binding up as suggested. I'd still lean towards the wheel bearing with the added info you've provided.

Also on the braking, if you have somewhere safe to do so, have you tried doing ABS-assisted panic stops from progressively higher speeds to see if that causes any difference? If it was a brake pad not seated or warped rotor, under a hard stop you might be able to feel an imbalance more even with the background ABS pulsing feedback through the brake pedal.


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## BDCCruze (Jul 12, 2017)

I checked both front tires today for play up/down as you would for a wheel bearing and found no play in the wheel. I can check with a pry bar tomorrow, didn't think about trying that today. Sway bar links are fine.

I had both front rotors turned and swapped them and the pads left/right sides and the sound is still there, hasn't changed. I was hopeful when the guy said the drivers front was really bad and required 3 passes, but nope, not the issue. While I was at it I also sprayed some silicon spray into the caliper piston and press them back in just to force in the lubrication.

One thing I did learn today is that I took some 220 wet/dry and taped it to a board, then wet sanded my brake pads left right and in circles for about 60 seconds each. Wow it brought them back to life, at least visually. They were very pitted and black and now they look brand new. I just wanted to make sure there was no contamination transferred from the pre-turned rotors.


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## BDCCruze (Jul 12, 2017)

One thing that is interesting about my problem is that sometimes when I hit the brakes and it starts knocking, _when I let off the brakes while turning_ the knocking will continue for several seconds until I straighten out the wheel. But it has never continued knocking after letting off when braking in a straight line. And I've had it happen sometimes when I touch the brakes for just a split second while turning it starts knocking, not even a hard stop.


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## ChevyGuy (Dec 13, 2014)

It seems to be the common part in all this is weight transfer. It might be the inner CV joints. Inner CV joints are not affected by turns like the outer ones, but would be sensitive to "ride height". Another thing might be bad motor mounts.


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## BDCCruze (Jul 12, 2017)

ChevyGuy said:


> It seems to be the common part in all this is weight transfer. It might be the inner CV joints. Inner CV joints are not affected by turns like the outer ones, but would be sensitive to "ride height". Another thing might be bad motor mounts.


Yes, interesting. Is there an easy way to diagnose inner CV joints?


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

BDCCruze said:


> Yes, interesting. Is there an easy way to diagnose inner CV joints?


Accelerate - HARD. If there's shaking under heavy acceleration at higher speeds, it's a dead giveaway.


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## BDCCruze (Jul 12, 2017)

Finally took it to the dealer. They cannot diagnose the problem, though they are able to reproduce the noise. They suggested trying a wheel bearing first but cannot guarantee that is the problem. I asked them if they dialed it and he said they did and it shows fine. They didn't say anything about looking at the drive axles. Just looked at the brakes and hub area.

Not sure if this is related or not, but I notice that the driver's front tire pressure always is 2 psi higher (according to the computer) than the other three. Even if I set them all identically with a gauge and rotate them, the one on the driver front has more pressure after driving for a while. I know it's a remote shot, but is the higher pressure caused by the hub/wheel heating up more, causing the psi to slightly increase? I expect the front tires to be warmer than rear, but the right front doesn't get as high as left front. It doesn't feel warmer to the touch, just a simple observation.


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## snowwy66 (Nov 5, 2017)

BDCCruze said:


> Guys, 14 Cruze TD 80k miles
> 
> I'm getting a knocking sound while I'm turning sharply, but it is only when there is a lot of downward force.
> 
> ...


CV joints pop anytime the steering wheel is turned. No matter what speed. The sharper the turn the sharper the pop. Usually only happens when the boot is torn and all the grease has flown out of the joint. Which don't take many miles to get there. 

Although they have been known to go bad with a boot still in good shape. Not often though.


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## Jondaytona (Apr 26, 2018)

I just fixed the same issue on a 2002 Silverado. In that case it was warped rotors in the rear. The pads were getting knocked around within the caliper brackets creating a slight knocking noise. After replacing the rotors (since the old ones were too thin to turn), all was good thereafter.

May or may not be OP's problem, but it sure was in the case of the Silverado.


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## BDCCruze (Jul 12, 2017)

I replaced the drivers front wheel bearing today.

I'm both happy and pissed.

I'm happy because I saved myself $375. I'm pissed because the problem still isn't fixed. The dealer wanted to just throw parts at it. What happened to genuine diagnosis these days? Dealers only pay their techs while they're turning wrenches, so they are incentivized to just quickly come to a conclusion and start putting on parts. I'm the one who ends up getting screwed in the end. I can't imagine how infuriated I would have been at the dealer had I gave permission to do what they wanted.


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## boraz (Aug 29, 2013)

hate wild goose chases like these

thoughts and prayers


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## BDCCruze (Jul 12, 2017)

Put the passengers front bearing on and replaced both front rotors. Still makes the same identical noise. I really get the feeling it's something in the drive shaft but I can't prove it. 

I'm still ahead cash wise had I done what the dealer wanted, but at least now they can't say it's either of those items.

I wonder if they did find something wrong (power train warranty issue) but wanted to milk me for cash so they made up something first to try at my expense, before they have their 'aha' moment and find the real issue. I had that happen to me with the side object sensor (cost me $400 bucks) .

I think I will try a different dealer now. Down to around 6,000 miles left on the power train warranty so I don't have much time, so I just put the parts on to remove that as a possible issue.


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## BDCCruze (Jul 12, 2017)

6 months and 14k miles later, the problem has been fixed.

Both inner CV joints were bad. They said the lateral play was excessive. Axles were covered by the PT warranty.


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## BDCCruze (Jul 12, 2017)

You guys will like this gem. I got the car back on a Thursday. It was raining a lot that weekend and I noticed a wet spot that wasn't drying up with the rest of the water. The following Tuesday I realized my car was leaking _something_. Got underneath and the whole bottom of the car was covered with transmission fluid. The splash shield was coated top and bottom. Took the car back that same day and just got it back yesterday. Between the original repair and the followup repair they had to put 3 axles seals on the drivers side to get one that didn't leak. Apparently parts are hard to find for these so it took over a week each time I took it in. Thankfully it was all covered under warranty, even the second time.


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

BDCCruze said:


> You guys will like this gem. I got the car back on a Thursday. It was raining a lot that weekend and I noticed a wet spot that wasn't drying up with the rest of the water. The following Tuesday I realized my car was leaking _something_. Got underneath and the whole bottom of the car was covered with transmission fluid. The splash shield was coated top and bottom. Took the car back that same day and just got it back yesterday. Between the original repair and the followup repair they had to put 3 axles seals on the drivers side to get one that didn't leak. Apparently parts are hard to find for these so it took over a week each time I took it in. Thankfully it was all covered under warranty, even the second time.


Yeah, I got mine back with an axle seal leak too. Super annoying. Check your work.


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## BDCCruze (Jul 12, 2017)

jblackburn said:


> Yeah, I got mine back with an axle seal leak too. Super annoying. Check your work.


What did you have your axles replaced for?


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

BDCCruze said:


> What did you have your axles replaced for?


Axles were fine; the '12 had the flywheel and transmission replaced under warranty.


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