# Cold Air Intakes Mythbusted



## TMcDermid (Mar 30, 2013)

What do you guys think of this?


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## woody13eco (Jan 20, 2013)

They should try them on an N/A car without an intercooler IMO.


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## Bac n Black (Aug 2, 2012)

I have always thought that they were nothing but expensive noise makers. But I like the noise. It is difficult to measure 10-15 Hp that so many of these companies claim you get, most of us measure the gain with a seat of the pants Dyno; and the noise makes us believe we have more HP. Most will not take their cars to dyno after purchase. It is also easy to manipulate the numbers. My 2cents.


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

It really just doesn't matter on a turbocharged car. The air goes through a high-pressure turbo and gets warmed up to 200-250 degrees by compression before it goes through the intercooler. That's with cold air intake temps in the winter.

On an N/A, sure, it can make a huge difference. Especially one with a crappy intake design that gets bogged down in the heat in the summer.


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## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

The reason companies claim 10-15 hp gain is because usually the 3rd-4th run is where the car peaks in efficiency. They do one run on stock set up to have their obviously low baseline the. The next two runs are usually averaged with slight gains looking much better than they actually are. You can expect 5hp out of a quality engineered intake. If CAIs and SRIs were not worth the time and effort then they wouldn't be used in racing. Full bolt ons and tuned on my 2.0L I4 N/A car netted 20hp total gain however the best improvements were in mid range torque and a better torque curve.


Sent from AutoGuide.com App


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## brian v (Dec 25, 2011)

True That -


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## CyclonicWrath (May 14, 2013)

It helps throttle response, Less restrictive air flow ... End of storey..


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## CyclonicWrath (May 14, 2013)

jblackburn said:


> It really just doesn't matter on a turbocharged car. The air goes through a high-pressure turbo and gets warmed up to 200-250 degrees by compression before it goes through the intercooler. That's with cold air intake temps in the winter.
> 
> On an N/A, sure, it can make a huge difference. Especially one with a crappy intake design that gets bogged down in the heat in the summer.


It actually does cool down the turbo a tad since it is cooler air hitting it first, but yes it does get hot after being compressed but if the turbo was sucking in hot air the turbo would be glowing red probably break down from thermal wear in my opinion.


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## shawn672 (Oct 31, 2010)

CyclonicWrath said:


> It actually does cool down the turbo a tad since it is cooler air hitting it first, but yes it does get hot after being compressed but if the turbo was sucking in hot air the turbo would be glowing red probably break down from thermal wear in my opinion.


The difference of 10 degree colder air does not matter when the air is being super heated...


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## brian v (Dec 25, 2011)

Why would not a difference of 10 degrees in the super heated air stream matter ?


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## shawn672 (Oct 31, 2010)

brian v said:


> Why would not a difference of 10 degrees in the super heated air stream matter ?


Because that's less than a 3% change in air temp
If it were a N/A engine, the same 10 degrees could be 10% or more difference

Dyno with a SRI and again with a CAI and show me the difference if you can produce one


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## shawn672 (Oct 31, 2010)

There have been so many threads over the internet on this, it's like beating a dead horse.. do some more research guys


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

CyclonicWrath said:


> It actually does cool down the turbo a tad since it is cooler air hitting it first, but yes it does get hot after being compressed but if the turbo was sucking in hot air the turbo would be glowing red probably break down from thermal wear in my opinion.


The only reason the turbo would be glowing red is if your car is running rich.

Or you're running 25+ PSI with a huge turbo.


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## CyclonicWrath (May 14, 2013)

jblackburn said:


> The only reason the turbo would be glowing red is if your car is running rich.
> 
> Or you're running 25+ PSI with a huge turbo.


I'm not saying the Cruze turbo will glow red lmfao, we are talking about Cold Air and the added air flow into the motor not really adding power but throttle response is a fact, if you don't want to agree I don't care I know I'm right I've only been racing for 14 years what do I know


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

Throttle response (on the Cruze), sure. But simply putting a less restrictive air filter in the stock air box and deleting the intake resonator snorkel accomplishes exactly the same thing.

On a non-turbo car, sure, the CAI makes a big difference.


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## CyclonicWrath (May 14, 2013)

You don't necessarily need a cold air intake I use the K&N Ram air intake, both I think are the same price and both give you better throttle response and in racing seconds matter..


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## CyclonicWrath (May 14, 2013)

jblackburn said:


> Throttle response (on the Cruze), sure. But simply putting a less restrictive air filter in the stock air box and deleting the intake resonator snorkel accomplishes exactly the same thing.
> 
> On a non-turbo car, sure, the CAI makes a big difference.


I don't think it makes a big difference actually in a N/A


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## shawn672 (Oct 31, 2010)

CyclonicWrath said:


> I don't think it makes a big difference actually in a N/A


It doesn't make a big difference anywhere, but it makes even less of a difference on a FI car


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## CyclonicWrath (May 14, 2013)

Cooler air is cooler air, that's like saying a Rad in a Fl (Fl I assume means Florida?) car doesn't make a difference..air passing through a rad no matter how hot will be cooler than your motor and cools down your cars coolant , it all makes a difference no matter what. Cooler air is only going to help any way you look at it...


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## shawn672 (Oct 31, 2010)

CyclonicWrath said:


> Cooler air is cooler air, that's like saying a Rad in a Fl (Fl I assume means Florida?) car doesn't make a difference..air passing through a rad no matter how hot will be cooler than your motor and cools down your cars coolant , it all makes a difference no matter what. Cooler air is only going to help any way you look at it...


FI = Forced Induction

I thought you've been racing for 14 years?

Also we're talking air intake temps pre and post turbo, which is what a SRI/CAI would affect - I'll allow you to repost without drilling further since you thought the "I" was an "L" in FI


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## Beachernaut (Mar 27, 2012)

If you throw an aftermarket intake on an otherwise stock car, you'r not going to get much. IMO much of the reason we don't see 10% (or more) power increase with just an intake is because the stock intake will flow as much (or close to) air as the engine requires. To keep things simple think of the engine as a big air pump. Say the stock intake will move 48 CFM (cubic feet per minute) of air, and the engine can move 50 CFM. Installing an SRI or CAI that moves 70 CFM, only gains you 2CFM and the other 20 CFM is wasted. Our cars are a great example. Look at aftermarket tunes for our cars. The main power adder is upping boost from the turbo, the rest is management for efficiency and safety. If the stock intake was so restrictive, we wouldn't see much if any power increase with a tune alone.

Now think about modifications to engines. Air intakes, ported throttle bodies, cams, high flow heads, bored cylinders, headers, hi-flow cats, etc. All of those help the engine pump more air. 

Cooler air contains more oxygen molecules. There's no way around that. A true CAI is always going to produce more power than an SRI (both moving the same CFM) however minute the difference is. That has more to do with the design of the engine compartment and grill area than anything else. Using things like heat wrap on the exhaust components in the engine bay, and vented hoods helps keep engine bay temps down, and will lower air intake temps in an SRI, but you're almost always going to have higher temps under the hood. IMO the choice between SRI and CAI is aesthetic. Once the car is moving the engine bay temps will go down, and the difference may be minimal. The only situation that stands out to me would be drag racing where under hood temps will rise while staging, and that extra few horses early in the race may make a difference. 

The guys in the video went about it the wrong way. Especially using a performance car. That car from the factory is going to have a stock intake that's capable of providing what the engine needs. Why would you design a performance car and then hobble it with the intake?


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## obermd (Mar 3, 2012)

I thought it was a 1 as in Formula 1. That's the problem with using abbreviations with a font where I, l, and 1 look almost the same.


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## iKermit (Dec 13, 2010)

If it makes a pretty noise, i buy it. I have a 1.8L and oh boy does it make a difference to me, it definetly responds better but if i got 2-3 HP more i will be lucky. If anything, the small ponies i have in my Cruze just respond better.

But i will tell you this, my MPG did for sure improve. Not a whole lot, but 1 MPG or 2 MPG will make a difference when i am too lazy to fill up at that gas station i just passed.


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## Beachernaut (Mar 27, 2012)

iKermit said:


> If it makes a pretty noise, i buy it. I have a 1.8L and oh boy does it make a different to me, it definetly responds better but i got 2-3 HP more i will be lucky. If anything, the small ponies i have in my Cruze just respond better.


LOL I gotta admit, if they weren't so expensive, I'd have an intake on my car. I love the sound of a turbo.


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## iKermit (Dec 13, 2010)

Beachernaut said:


> LOL I gotta admit, if they weren't so expensive, I'd have an intake on my car. I love the sound of a turbo.



Yeah they sure make the BOV sound real nice. But they aren't that expensive, when we have group buys they are at a good reasonable price. Expensive was the one i had on my TL, $470 (i got the one for the Cruze for like $250 something i think)


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## TMcDermid (Mar 30, 2013)

iKermit said:


> If it makes a pretty noise, i buy it. I have a 1.8L and oh boy does it make a difference to me, it definetly responds better but if i got 2-3 HP more i will be lucky. If anything, the small ponies i have in my Cruze just respond better.
> 
> But i will tell you this, my MPG did for sure improve. Not a whole lot, but 1 MPG or 2 MPG will make a difference when i am too lazy to fill up at that gas station i just passed.


Glad to see a 1.8 driver noticed something. I am consider a SRI as my next mod.


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## TMcDermid (Mar 30, 2013)

Beachernaut said:


> If you throw an aftermarket intake on an otherwise stock car, you'r not going to get much. IMO much of the reason we don't see 10% (or more) power increase with just an intake is because the stock intake will flow as much (or close to) air as the engine requires. To keep things simple think of the engine as a big air pump. Say the stock intake will move 48 CFM (cubic feet per minute) of air, and the engine can move 50 CFM. Installing an SRI or CAI that moves 70 CFM, only gains you 2CFM and the other 20 CFM is wasted. Our cars are a great example. Look at aftermarket tunes for our cars. The main power adder is upping boost from the turbo, the rest is management for efficiency and safety. If the stock intake was so restrictive, we wouldn't see much if any power increase with a tune alone.
> 
> Now think about modifications to engines. Air intakes, ported throttle bodies, cams, high flow heads, bored cylinders, headers, hi-flow cats, etc. All of those help the engine pump more air.
> 
> ...


Definitely makes sense - great post.


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## iKermit (Dec 13, 2010)

TMcDermid said:


> Glad to see a 1.8 driver noticed something. I am consider a SRI as my next mod.


Personally i liked the CAI better. But after hydrolocking my car i learned my lesson. (Floods everywhere here, and BIG floods)

SRI felt more responsive at speeds of 40+. CAI was more responsive at stop and go (if i remember correctly).

Anyone can try and disprove whatever they want, race cars wouldn't use SRI's if it didn't make a difference. Of course we don't have a race car, but i don't need a dyno to prove anything. I know how my car feels and reacts when i make an engine mod. Anything can be proven wrong, ANYTHING, if i use all my resources to prove that we came from robots that made us, trust me, i will have a small group following me.

And infact i do... waitwat


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## CyclonicWrath (May 14, 2013)

Yeah my bad I thought it was a lower case L.. I was like what does it matter about a fuel injected car or not so went with Florida.. lol but superchargers I know for a fact benefit from cooler air, cooler air is better. less restrictive flow is better. You may not get a hp gain no! but responsiveness of the motor will be improved and temperature of moving parts will be improved.. I race motocross btw not cars I just know that having better air flow will give you more responsiveness and power. You may have to tinker with the carb or computers but you will still notice responsiveness of the batt, I did from my ram air which I prefer because I'm scared of getting water sucked in like stated above, since it is my work car..


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## shawn672 (Oct 31, 2010)

CyclonicWrath said:


> superchargers I know for a fact benefit from cooler air, cooler air is better. less restrictive flow is better.


Yes, this is very true, because superchargers don't super heat the air like a turbo does. Say a 10 degree difference between CAI and SRI, would result in maybe 295 degrees vs 305 after the turbo... really doesn't matter. So you're better off with the better responsiveness from the SRI since the possibility of cooler air of a CAI is irrelevant in Forced Induction (FI) cars


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## springer64 (May 14, 2013)

shawn672 said:


> Yes, this is very true, because superchargers don't super heat the air like a turbo does. Say a 10 degree difference between CAI and SRI, would result in maybe 295 degrees vs 305 after the turbo... really doesn't matter. So you're better off with the better responsiveness from the SRI since the possibility of cooler air of a CAI is irrelevant in Forced Induction (FI) cars


cai is not irrelevant with fi. the video clearly shows a 1.7 percent gain over stock on at least 2 dyno runs. and this is over an already decent stock cai. plus they showed a definite loss when going to an open filter under the hood. 

i'd have to watch it again and do the math for gain from open filter under the hood to their best cai but it's dam sure more than 1.7 percent.

from what i read, many guys on here spend plenty for 1.7 percent.


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## caughron01 (Mar 25, 2013)

springer64 said:


> cai is not irrelevant with fi. the video clearly shows a 1.7 percent gain over stock on at least 2 dyno runs. and this is over an already decent stock cai. plus they showed a definite loss when going to an open filter under the hood.
> 
> i'd have to watch it again and do the math for gain from open filter under the hood to their best cai but it's dam sure more than 1.7 percent.
> 
> from what i read, many guys on here spend plenty for 1.7 percent.


That was after taping the filter to a hose and hanging it out of the car though..... Who want's to do that?


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## brian v (Dec 25, 2011)

shawn672 said:


> There have been so many threads over the internet on this, it's like beating a dead horse.. do some more research guys





So Why are You Beating a Dead Horse Man ?
WE all here have opinions and theories ! 
I guess we will have to look at the science to educate us about this theory and discern for ourselves . 

The Grateful Dead are Cool ! Do you Like the Dead Man ?




You Have to Love it and Laugh !


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## springer64 (May 14, 2013)

caughron01 said:


> That was after taping the filter to a hose and hanging it out of the car though..... Who want's to do that?


why doesn't everybody? lol
seriously i wonder if there would be enough demand for a diy scoop, buying the kit from some vendor, for a cold air scoop on the hood mod? i think it should be reversed - opening towards rear. be really cool to have the flap type cowl induction hood ala 70 chevelle 454 LS6.


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## brian v (Dec 25, 2011)

I want a shaker hood to go along with all of this junk so it just looks cool .NAH 
The silver would just get jealous . <<<442 rules the garage >>>


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## Nathan of Aus. (May 16, 2013)

In the real world, if you use high-flow filters, put them in a box and then run pipes to the bumper intakes you can get about a* 5%* increase.

Most people use open pods which will suck in hot air from the engine bay and thus actually not alter power or even *reduce *it despite the increased flow. 

Most performance cars use a "snorkel" to get cold air to the filter anyway. An example was my previous car which was a 03 WRX. It had a snorkel over 1 foot wide and 1 inch high across the upper bumper intake as stock. Replacing this with an open pod would definitely result in power *loss.


*I believe that a lot of people get the 10-20% gain as a result of a tune after applying a new intake. What they do not realise is that 5-15% of that 10-20% gain could have been achieved by simply tuning the car with the stock intake.


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## brian v (Dec 25, 2011)

True That ! 


Regards


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## springer64 (May 14, 2013)

brian v said:


> I want a shaker hood to go along with all of this junk so it just looks cool .NAH
> The silver would just get jealous . <<<442 rules the garage >>>


roger the 442!!

and nathan, i think with a proper factory cai such as shown at the beginning video a tune will result in more hp than the tune with the quasi cai that is open to underhood air.

those guys actually didn't debunk cai at all but they did show that a quasi cai [in name only] loses hp.


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## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

I don't feel you can really argue OEM col air snorkels. The problem is that air is a fluid. Fluids take the path of least resistance. OEM systems are meant for colder air aide at high way speeds. They try to place them at high pressure areas on the car at around 55-60mph. Sometimes they get it right sometimes not. Just don't think of OEM cold
air intakes as the "best choice". Sometimes depending on the car it may be a spot that no one thinks of. A good example would be my car. Honda located the stock cold air snorkel in the left side fender and down towards the ground. However an aftermarket company using a very good aerodynamicist found that the base of the windshield actually yielded a higher pressure pokey of air at the base of the windshield where it meets the hood due to the very acute angle of the front windshield. There's always something to find on these new cars! 

Also sorry for typos I'm on my phone and to lazy to fix!


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## ErikBEggs (Aug 20, 2011)

It sounds cool, it looks great in the engine bay, it increased my fuel economy by 5-10% on the highway, what's not to love?

I don't know if or how much horsepower I gained, but my data logs from trifecta did show the car sucking in cooler air. It wasn't COLD, but sucking in cooler air is better than sucking in the hot crap in my engine bay. Sure it gets heated, but it will come out cooler than if it wasn't heated.. even if it is only a couple percent.


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