# Supercharger



## Mick (Dec 31, 2011)

I'm surprised these haven't been discussed yet. Where's all the love?
Any rumors of anyone working on one. I prefer going this route when I get to that phase. I'm particularly interested in a centrifugal type. 

Thoughts?

Dibs on being donor for you vendors.


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## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

What's the point when the car is already equipped with a turbo that can put down over 200 lb-ft of torque to the wheels?


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## boats4life (May 28, 2011)

Maybe he's suggesting for the 1.8L?


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## Mick (Dec 31, 2011)

Lol not every car is equipped with the turbo. But yeah I have a 1.8.


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## boats4life (May 28, 2011)

That would be an AWESOME mod, just gotta find someone to do the R&D...


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## H3LLON3ARTH (Dec 16, 2011)

Well heres an idea how about both in the same car it had worked in europe

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## Calintz (Jul 21, 2011)

it will be awesome to see a supercharger kit for the 1.8L


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## boats4life (May 28, 2011)

H3LLON3ARTH said:


> Well heres an idea how about both in the same car it had worked in europe
> 
> Sent from my R800x using AutoGuide.com App


Are you suggesting a turbo AND supercharger? What was that configuration on?

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## H3LLON3ARTH (Dec 16, 2011)

Ill have to watch fifth gear to find out but I know theres a car in europe with it

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## limited360 (May 6, 2011)

Volkswagen sold a 'twin charge' car...


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## H3LLON3ARTH (Dec 16, 2011)

Article Summary

At the International Motor Show (Cars) in Frankfurt, Volkswagen is presenting to the general public a groundbreaking innovation in the drive sector: The world’s first twinturbocharged FSI engine – the “Twincharger”. The compact 1.4 litre direct-injection engine develops 125 kW / 170 PS and has a maximum torque of 240 newton metres in the range from 1750 to 4500 rpm thanks to the combination of an exhaust turbocharger with a mechanically driven compressor. Furthermore, the “Twincharger” delivers a torque corresponding to a naturally aspirated engine of approximately 2.3 litres. And its fuel consumption is around 20 percent lower.


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## limited360 (May 6, 2011)

H3LLON3ARTH said:


> Article Summary
> 
> At the International Motor Show (Cars) in Frankfurt, Volkswagen is presenting to the general public a groundbreaking innovation in the drive sector: The world’s first twinturbocharged FSI engine – the “Twincharger”. The compact 1.4 litre direct-injection engine develops 125 kW / 170 PS and has a maximum torque of 240 newton metres in the range from 1750 to 4500 rpm thanks to the combination of an exhaust turbocharger with a mechanically driven compressor. Furthermore, the “Twincharger” delivers a torque corresponding to a naturally aspirated engine of approximately 2.3 litres. And its fuel consumption is around 20 percent lower.
> 
> ...


I don't think it was ever produced... For obvious reasons. More effective and efficient ways to make power... And way less complicated as well! Main push for this was emissions while making power is all.


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## H3LLON3ARTH (Dec 16, 2011)

Im lpoking for a video im sure it was

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## H3LLON3ARTH (Dec 16, 2011)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvysuD5MFow&feature=youtube_gdata_player 

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## limited360 (May 6, 2011)

H3LLON3ARTH said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvysuD5MFow&feature=youtube_gdata_player
> 
> Sent from my R800x using AutoGuide.com App


Audi did a high HP variant of the TT like this... Wasn't for production however.


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## Jim Frye (Mar 16, 2011)

I read last month that BMW is designing a triple turbo engine. Two are driven by exhaust gases and the third is electrically driven. I suspect the electroturbo is for low end torque. I wonder if you could build an engine with a turbo for each cylinder? Think of the howl they would make.


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## limited360 (May 6, 2011)

Google 'quad turbo eclipse' .... Been done before!


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## iCruze2 (Dec 16, 2011)

The 2005-2007 Cobalt SS's came supercharged, and plenty of companies offered a kit to Twin Charge it. Been done here. In most cases, didn't work properly LOL


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## limited360 (May 6, 2011)

Mini cooper is another car that is twin charged from the aftermarket


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## Snuze (Nov 6, 2011)

There's a reason you don't see twin charging - its complicated and tends to not offer much in the way of power gains over a well thought out and properly sized turbo. But it does add weight. 

If you're interested in going blown on a 1.8, I highly recommend checking out Rotrex. They make planetary drive centrifugal charger that is almost as efficient as a turbo.


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## H3LLON3ARTH (Dec 16, 2011)

Snuze said:


> There's a reason you don't see twin charging - its complicated and tends to not offer much in the way of power gains over a well thought out and properly sized turbo. But it does add weight.
> 
> If you're interested in going blown on a 1.8, I highly recommend checking out Rotrex. They make planetary drive centrifugal charger that is almost as efficient as a turbo.


I second this

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## limited360 (May 6, 2011)

Control systems required to manage two different volumetric efficiency adders that function in two different ways...and need to be robust and last for the life of the vehicle... Than doing diagnostics on those two devices and being able to isolate separate fault paths is a main driver for this never being mass produced, especially here in the land of rules and regulations.


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## Mick (Dec 31, 2011)

A buddy has a twin charged 86. I'll post the website on his how to if anyone is interested.

I think twin charging would defeat the purpose on this car. Yes I want to add power but I don't want to sacrifice all my mpg's.
I think the centrifugal would be perfect because it's not over the top on boost, don't need a hole in your hood and no need for an intercooler. At cruising speeds it should actually help on mpg's I think but once the power is needed, it will be there. Only way to know for sure is testing it. It's available for the Camaro so I'm hopeful we may see this someday.


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## Mick (Dec 31, 2011)

Bmw has been working on the electric/exhaust turbo combo. I'm actually surprised it hads't been put into production yet.


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## boats4life (May 28, 2011)

I can definitely see an advantage to the electroturbo to build boost before the exhaust turbo has a chance to spool...


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## sciphi (Aug 26, 2011)

Rotrex-powered Miata is a realistic toy vehicle for a few years from now. Those cars make some very reliable power. 

It'd be something sweet to see on a Cruze 1.8. The steelies would fool most folks into thinking it's another LS.


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## NBrehm (Jun 27, 2011)

I don't think there has been a production car but I have seen some racers that do it on older VW's, use the SC to spool a big turbo, works very well, kinda along the same idea as sequential turbos


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## boats4life (May 28, 2011)

I'd love to see somebody experiment with the sequential setup on the 1.4!


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## NickD (Dec 10, 2011)

No such thing as a bolt on supercharger, a supercharged engine is entirely different than a naturally aspirated engine in every respect.

Yes, add on superchargers are available, also call them a blower, and a blower it is. Putting one of these on a non-modified naturally aspirated engine will literally "blow" that engine to ****.


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## Mick (Dec 31, 2011)

Hmm I'm not too convinced with your argument. But being that I don't have much experience in the subject I'm going to refrain from posting my thoughts before doing further research.


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## NickD (Dec 10, 2011)

Was with GEICO for 26 years, filling out their forms each year and sending them money, not a single claim, no tickets. When I called them that I purchased a 88 Supra, they refused to cover it because it had a turbo. Used the argument, gets 3 more miles per gallon than the non-turbo model and got nowhere. Actually they did me a favor, found better deals at other insurance companies.

Had thoughts about buying a turbo Cruze for this same reason, AAA actually is charging me less for full coverage than my 04 Cavalier, eight years newer, but guess its because it has ten air bags. Driven properly, a turbo actually recovers energy normally blown out the exhaust pipe and improves fuel economy. While both the turbo and non-turbo Supra's still use a 3.0L engine, it stops there, every component under the hood and drivetrain is different, far heavier engine and drivetrain components. Suspension and brakes are entirely different.

Hope the Cruze did the same thing with the 1.4L engine, really a rather large engine with only 86 cubes displacement.

My son's friend purchased a new Mustang, took it to Minneapolis to have a supercharger installed, cost him a small fortune, ask him about engine modifications, was told he didn't need any. First time he hit the gas, threw a rod through his block. This is just one incident, was on a Supra site with a bunch of idiots adding turbo to a non-turbo engine. Were crying because the head blew off the block. Can take this way back to the 50's if you want me to put you to sleep with bedtime stories.

Never rodded my Supra, never drove it in the winter months, just getting 3 free miles per gallon. My only defense as to how the oil companies are screwing us and have been since 1973. Not really a fun car to drive either, can get a speeding ticket when parked.


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## sciphi (Aug 26, 2011)

Topswapping an L36 (NA 3800 Series II V6) with an L67's (supercharged 3800 Series II V6) supercharger and intake manifold is pretty common. They can last a long time, or they can blow up 2000 miles later. It depends on desired power levels, and how it's tuned. The tuning's the most important part of the equation. Any grease monkey can throw a supercharger onto a naturally aspirated engine. Getting that engine to run reliably is the art of tuning.


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## 70AARCUDA (Nov 14, 2010)

...could (?) the *Toyota* Supercharger that was offered on the early 1.8L Pontiac Vibes be made to fit/work?


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## carey965 (Sep 6, 2011)

I drove a supercharged cavalier with a 2.4 for many years reliably and th motor was stock internally 
There was also a guy in alberta running a twin charged sunfire with the same engine with only a few top end upgrades everyday for over a year

You can boost any engine and still keep its reliable with proper tuning and fuel mods. And not over doing it on the boost
I have been hoping for gm to do a m62 kit for this car since i bought it i miss the whine of a blower


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## carey965 (Sep 6, 2011)

70AARCUDA said:


> ...could (?) the *Toyota* Supercharger that was offered on the early 1.8L Pontiac Vibes be made to fit/work?


Anything can be made to fit. But the question is it worth the hassle 
That kit probably not


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## Mick (Dec 31, 2011)

Those are pretty much my points. The life of an engine doesn't really depend much on the fact that you added a turbo/supercharger, but who installed it, how it was tuned and who is driving it. None of us bought a 1.8 Cruze for performance. in my case, it was fuel economy and only nice thing within my budget. But it would be nice to be able to try to pass on a highway or merge onto a freeway without squeezing your butt cheeks. Or enjoy it on the occasional track day.
A supercharger, especially one with low boost will only be called upon when needed. I for one don't feel the need to squeal tires at every stop, in front of girls or need to get a 10 second run to the next stop light. So it would really only work hard about 20% of the time. If that.

Cuda, the bolt on trd kit for the 1zzfe was also used on the 1.8 corolla which has almost matching specs as the Cruze. 
Just in case you (or any vendors) get bored and want to do more research haha


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## 70AARCUDA (Nov 14, 2010)

...yeah, I know, that's why I tossed the idea out there. Also, remember that the whole TRD "kit" was also available through GM, so maybe some "ex" Pontiac dealership somewhere might have one sitting back in some corner gathering dust?


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## Jim Frye (Mar 16, 2011)

A friend of mine put a Paxton supercharger kit on his '64 Corvair. The motor handled the mod pretty well, as it never blew up. The transaxle and rear swing arm suspension were just not up to the task though. You have to look at the entire drive train when doing something that drastic.


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## Mick (Dec 31, 2011)

I totally agree. I trust the engineers take everything into consideration. 

Was your friend running an original drivetrain?


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## Jim Frye (Mar 16, 2011)

Mick said:


> I totally agree. I trust the engineers take everything into consideration.
> 
> Was your friend running an original drivetrain?


Yes, and he broke quite a few parts of it. When I built up my '65, I replaced everything I could with competition quality parts. I still wore out syncros and snapped a couple of input shafts anyway. The input shaft was the weakest link in the drive train. Due to the design of the transaxle, you couldn't simply make it thicker, so no one made a higher strength one. You just didn't run the rpm up and dump the clutch. If the tires hooked up too soon, you'd break it.


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## NickD (Dec 10, 2011)

Kit was available for my Supra Turbo, two stage turbo, intercooler, pistons, exhaust, heavy connecting rods, pistons, suspension, etc. Back then the price tag was 11K bucks, guaranteed 625 HP out of that 3 L. Thought about it for a couple of minutes, can only drive the darn thing at 55 anyway.

For an occasional boost, could consider nitro, see those kits available as well. No complaints with the 1.4 L turbo, drive a lot on two lane roads with mostly no passing zones. Get some cat that practically kills himself and you to pull out in front of you and drive between 35-45 mph. When you finally get a chance to pass these AH's, find you are doing 80 and still not getting around them.

Have thoughts of other than a supercharger or nitro, a 12 gauge shot gun, but so far, only thoughts. But just find a nice MP3 to listen too.

Think when you talk tune up when adding a supercharger, meaning a bit more than just changing the plugs. Can also kiss your 100K powertrain warranty, goodbye.


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## Kinmartin0789 (Feb 18, 2011)

NickD Pics or it didnt happen! lol jsut kidding but id love to see picks of your supra!


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