# The Truth About Diesel Particulate Filter Problems (DPF Problems)



## GotDiesel? (Sep 9, 2013)

This is very true .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bOlDFFhuPM


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## grs1961 (Oct 23, 2012)

Please ignore Cadogan, he has a habit of saying to vehicle importers, "Give me such-and-such a vehicle for a year or I'll give you a bad review."

He's an arsehole, to put it simply. And I don't give a fat rat's clacker if the asterisker can't handle "arsehole."


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## snowwy66 (Nov 5, 2017)

Dpf has been out 11 years now. Def 8 years. And they're not going away.

If you don't like em. Don't buy a diesel. 

From what you all are posting. Seems like a hassle owning one in the winter time anyways. Other then the better fuel economy. And i guess the longer range. What's the purpose of owning one?

Has anyone figured the cost per mile of fuel vs. gas. Being that fuel is roughly $.60 higher per gallon.


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## BobJacobson (Jan 10, 2018)

snowwy66 said:


> From what you all are posting. Seems like a hassle owning one in the winter time anyways. Other then the better fuel economy. And i guess the longer range. What's the purpose of owning one?
> 
> Has anyone figured the cost per mile of fuel vs. gas. Being that fuel is roughly $.60 higher per gallon.


Kind of answered your own question. Fuel economy and longer range.

Up here in Canadia the economics are a bit different as gas and diesel are usually pretty close. Currently diesel is 8 cents a gallon more last week it was 8 cents less.

I think most people realize that there isn't a huge economic benefit unless you drive a lot of highway miles.


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## MOTO13 (Mar 26, 2014)

snowwy66 said:


> Dpf has been out 11 years now. Def 8 years. And they're not going away.
> 
> If you don't like em. Don't buy a diesel.
> 
> ...


Ever own a diesel? I will never go back to gas. I had a few problems with my CTD but it was mainly sensors. I have 48k on mine now and have been friggin happy as heck overall. Nothing like a diesel for some reason. I get an easy 60 mpg when I go to Iowa. Power is excellent and the engine lives in oil, so the longevity should be great. I couldn't even imagine going to a 40 mpg car any longer and 40 mpg is good, just not good enough for me. It would pi$$ me off seeing anything under 50 mpg for some reason. Either you like diesels or you don't. For those that don't, I don't get that either.


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## IndyDiesel (May 24, 2015)

That’s video was just really annoying. I have had almost ZERO problems with my diesel for 54k miles. EGR valve open no start, took 45min and cleaned and back on road. Def tank heater, replaced under special warranty in a day. That’s it. No other issues. I don’t fret over stuff, I haven’t even personally bought def fluid yet, free changes Of def Heater replacement I guess. I couldn’t be happier. I didn’t finish the video, I don’t enjoy watching junk like that. Diesel isn’t for everyone.


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## snowwy66 (Nov 5, 2017)

MOTO13 said:


> Ever own a diesel? I will never go back to gas. I had a few problems with my CTD but it was mainly sensors. I have 48k on mine now and have been friggin happy as heck overall. Nothing like a diesel for some reason. I get an easy 60 mpg when I go to Iowa. Power is excellent and the engine lives in oil, so the longevity should be great. I couldn't even imagine going to a 40 mpg car any longer and 40 mpg is good, just not good enough for me. It would pi$$ me off seeing anything under 50 mpg for some reason. Either you like diesels or you don't. For those that don't, I don't get that either.


Nope. I like the reliability of gas. Don't have to worry about glow plugs, fuel gel, clogged dpf, frozen def. 

I drive semi's. That's enough deisel for me.


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## mkohan (Dec 19, 2015)

Just turned 60K on mine without any CEL's or any other problems. It uses a little over 3 gals of DEF every 10K. Been a reliable fun to drive car for me.


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## GotDiesel? (Sep 9, 2013)

Hey everyone , I posted this for amusement , yes the guy is a smuck and thought we all would get a few good laugh out of it.


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## 91794 (Mar 25, 2015)

The guy is annoying and bald but he seems to be 100% correct about everything he mentioned. 8k mile on my 2017 in 2 months, one DEF sensor recall, and now a check-engine light. I haven’t bothered to read the OBD/check-engine code yet. Maybe some day this week. I was hoping the my-chevy app would report the OBD/check-engine fault code to me. But nooooo. As always, i don’t care much about that expected software/sensor/DPF stuff as long as the manual transmission keeps shifting right and the engine keeps running like new, nice loud shaky vibrato at idle especially when not fully warmed up. On a cold winter start it’s especially funny that they called this engine a ‘whisper diesel’. 

I love the sounds of compression-based ignition in the morning! 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## GotDiesel? (Sep 9, 2013)

eli said:


> The guy is annoying and bald but he seems to be 100% correct about everything he mentioned. 8k mile on my 2017 in 2 months, one DEF sensor recall, and now a check-engine light. I haven’t bothered to read the OBD/check-engine code yet. Maybe some day this week. I was hoping the my-chevy app would report the OBD/check-engine fault code to me. But nooooo. As always, i don’t care much about that expected software/sensor/DPF stuff as long as the manual transmission keeps shifting right and the engine keeps running like new, nice loud shaky vibrato at idle especially when not fully warmed up. On a cold winter start it’s especially funny that they called this engine a ‘whisper diesel’.
> 
> I love the sounds of compression-based ignition in the morning!
> 
> ...


 
Yes it's Whisper Diesel (when it's warmed up LOL) 
Like you I love Compression-based ignition as well ..the gen I was like an VW ALH motor so I welcome the sound of a diesel ....


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## 91794 (Mar 25, 2015)

My first diesel was an ALH in a 2001 VW Jetta wagon stickshift . Had 3 more VW pre-cheater diesels after that. The ALH was my favorite VW TDI engine too.


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## JDH (Dec 24, 2014)

snowwy66 said:


> Other then the better fuel economy. And i guess the longer range. What's the purpose of owning one?


The low end torque is amazing for one. The people smarter than you that walk up to you at the pump and whisper "you know that is the diesel pump?" or yell "Hey dumbass you just put diesel in your car!" for everyone to hear get a really puzzled look on their faces when you say "I hope so" and drive off. Kinda makes your day.



snowwy66 said:


> Has anyone figured the cost per mile of fuel vs. gas. Being that fuel is roughly $.60 higher per gallon.


the difference is .38 at the Texaco closest to the house. My wife got 35 combined city/hwy in her gen 1 diesel, (a little higher in the gen 2). Neighbor gets 28 in her gen 1 gas. Diesel is $2.59, gas $2.21 at said Texaco. 7.4 cents/mile for the diesel. 7.8 c/m for the gas. Highway only gen 1 diesel 259/53= 4.9 c/m, gas 221/38=5.8 c/m. Side note I can get 60+ highway in the Gen 2 diesel dropping it down to 4.3 c/m.

Yes, I know that means you have to put a lot (300000 +/-) of miles on it to recoup the cost difference.


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## Snipesy (Dec 7, 2015)

Yes, let's all delete the dpfs. I am a libertarian and say I should be able to do anything I want! 

**** my daughter has lung cancer. Not my fault though, just bad luck I guess.


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## snowwy66 (Nov 5, 2017)

Should we all delete the catalytic convertor too?


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## DrKlahn (Feb 10, 2014)

Well there's a lot of variables. For me I got my Gen 1 as a program car for less than what a gasser would cost. The Gen 2 I bought as a '17 closeout, again for a very competitive price as well. Our usage model and philosophy is a bit different. I commute 50-60 miles a day. The wife is about 40 miles a day. We both decided a few years ago that even though I'm handy with a wrench and know my way around PCM/BCM diagnostics that having a car with an extended warranty works best for us. We just budget around a payment and buy the warranty up front with the understanding that in 4-5 years we're going to do it again. Any failure of either vehicle the dealer takes care of us. We're not trying to chase down parts or budget a rental in the event of a breakdown (or working on it -20*F). So it boils down to operating costs. I've kept a spreadsheet for years and even with buying a couple DEF refills and some Power Service treatment in the winter, the Gen 1 diesel had far less operating cost vs. the Cobalt it replaced. The Gen 2 is on track to reduce this even further as so far it gets a consistent 7-10 more MPG vs. the Gen 1. 

Reliability wise I had to take the Gen 1 into the shop twice for a recall and once for a pump failure on the DEF tank. Only the DEF tank was an inconvenience (Dealer provided rental) as I was able to drop the car off for oil changes and do the recalls at the same time. The Gen 1 never gelled or stranded us. We took it on a couple trips and as others have reported the mileage and torque were outstanding. The Gen 2 has gelled on me once. I contacted KyleB (who has a thread in here) via PM and both of us used the same station brand (Kum&Go and we're both in the same city) so I suspect that the distributor has a bad batch. I have since filled at a different station and no issues since (this morning the wind chill is in the -20 to -40* range). So hassle and reliability wise I don't really have any complaints.


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## 91794 (Mar 25, 2015)

I parked on a snow in my driveway as I often do with my fleet of vehicles. With the 2017 cruze diesel the result seems to be a bent-90-degrees pointing directly downward a metal flap wn from under the right front of the car, exposing a BIG hole in something.

I think it may be a belly shield or the DPF itself. 
Also check-engine light occurred - dunno which code it's throwing. 
Car is at dealership now. 

The check-engine code may be "Are you some kind of VW cheater? You just tore the DPF entirely off of the car." . Maybe it's due to defect that the metal flap thing could "catch" on something as forgiving as a couple inches of snow, and bend downward like that. Or maybe it's due to a boneheaded driver. Or both. 

A new thread will probably result from this repair and engine code once it's finalized. 

If indeed I did accidentally remove the DPF, i haven't noticed any drivability issue, the car runs same as before. I wonder if the dealer could just cut off the huge flap and leave the DPF with a huge hole in it if I opt not to have it repaired. :| Maybe I accidentally discovered an easy way to remove the DPF - just rip a huge hole in it by driving over too many inches of dense snow. The ECM will detect it lack of pressure inside DPF - will throw the engine code - and it will never use the DPF again, or any DEF. maybe it would detect the "stale DEF" after a year or three of not using DEF ! :|


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## MRO1791 (Sep 2, 2016)

snowwy66 said:


> Nope. I like the reliability of gas. Don't have to worry about glow plugs, fuel gel, clogged dpf, frozen def.
> 
> I drive semi's. That's enough deisel for me.


Modern Gas engines are having challenges too due to the CAFE standards, and stricter emissions.. there is no free lunch here. There is a Gen 2 thread on the Gas engine where an owner of two cars has had BOTH blow the #1 piston at about 30K miles.. 

The limits are being pushed on all engine technologies to meet regulations.. no one gets off without some possible downside.


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## MRO1791 (Sep 2, 2016)

It is almost certainly not the DPF, it is likely a heat shield for the exhaust, and the code is likely related to a damaged sensor(s), and/or the DEF injector which is in about that location from your description. A hole in the DEF would take much more than just snow, it is heat shielded heavy gauge Stainless steel, bolted to the front of the engine. To damage the DPF, you would have likely totaled the car, and had airbags deploy.


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## snowwy66 (Nov 5, 2017)

MRO1791 said:


> Modern Gas engines are having challenges too due to the CAFE standards, and stricter emissions.. there is no free lunch here. There is a Gen 2 thread on the Gas engine where an owner of two cars has had BOTH blow the #1 piston at about 30K miles..
> 
> The limits are being pushed on all engine technologies to meet regulations.. no one gets off without some possible downside.


There's 2 plus 1 car with piston failure. On this forum. And neither have absolutely anything to do with your statement. That's 3 cars that we know of. Out of how many millions out on the road. 

Whatever caused those pistons to fail. It's more then likely a assembly flaw or design flaw. Or maybe operations problem from the owners driving habits. Although, I'd think that if it were a design flaw. There would have been a serious recall.

Nobody has posted yet as to why that 1 piston has failed. For all we know. They all went out to the tracks and raced.


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## MRO1791 (Sep 2, 2016)

snowwy66 said:


> There's 2 plus 1 car with piston failure. On this forum. And neither have absolutely anything to do with your statement. That's 3 cars that we know of. Out of how many millions out on the road.
> 
> Whatever caused those pistons to fail. It's more then likely a assembly flaw or design flaw. Or maybe operations problem from the owners driving habits. Although, I'd think that if it were a design flaw. There would have been a serious recall.
> 
> Nobody has posted yet as to why that 1 piston has failed. For all we know. They all went out to the tracks and raced.


Only a VERY tiny percentage of owners will ever comment on a forum like this, so we will only see tip of iceburg type of issues. That is the first point. The next one is the basic mis-understanding that is out there that all defects will generate a recall.. simply not true. GM, or any OEM only has to recall items that are a safety issue. A blown engine is not a safety issue. The VW HPFP failures were legion, and the NHTSA did an extensive report, and confirmed it as a legitimate design issue.. yet because a sudden loss of power and broke car had not resulted in any accident, nor was assumed to be likely would result in an accident, they would not order a recall. Same applies here. 
What an OEM will do in a case such as this, would be a TSB, they might do a re-program of the ECU next service visit, or even extend the warranty on the particular item known to fail early, but it won't be a recall, and the absence of a recall is not an indication there is not a real design issue, or challenge in play.. it just means it's not safety related. 

Hope that helps clear it up a bit.


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## MRO1791 (Sep 2, 2016)

Just finished the video.. This guy was a little off on the other video I watched about the auto-stop feature.. especially how it works for GM. But mostly right on this one. I found not much to take issue with. Some might disagree with his take on doing a DPF delete, but when he says it would be illegal, and risky.. it is true... whether it's really a big risk of lung cancer is the only real uncertain claim I could find in this video. It is true that the dealership won't tell you about the drive profiles that spell problems for a DPF, I've seen that first hand. I would hesitate to recommend a Diesel to someone who does almost exclusively city driving, because it would almost certainly lead to problems, but don't expect that kind of advice from any salesperson at a dealership. I love Diesels (having 4 should make that pretty obvious!), but I also recognize the limitations of the emissions systems, and knowing them I'm able to drive in a way to minimize the downside. Just yesterday I was in the Gen 1.. got to where I was going.. noted the regen in progress, but almost done.. so I drove around for about 3 more minutes, let it finish and cool off, then parked. That is the kind of thing that helps prevent issues, and neither the sales people at the dealership, nor the manufacture will provide the indications or information to let the average driver do that, because they assume, and in most cases correctly, that the average driver doesn't want to know, nor do they care about such things..


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## BobJacobson (Jan 10, 2018)

MRO1791 said:


> Just yesterday I was in the Gen 1.. got to where I was going.. noted the regen in progress, but almost done.. so I drove around for about 3 more minutes, let it finish and cool off, then parked. That is the kind of thing that helps prevent issues, and neither the sales people at the dealership, nor the manufacture will provide the indications or information to let the average driver do that, because they assume, and in most cases correctly, that the average driver doesn't want to know, nor do they care about such things..


How can you tell when a regen is happening? I drive like 95% highway but I'd really like to know if I end up in a situation like that so I can let It finish it's process.


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## snowwy66 (Nov 5, 2017)

MRO1791 said:


> Only a VERY tiny percentage of owners will ever comment on a forum like this, so we will only see tip of iceburg type of issues. That is the first point. The next one is the basic mis-understanding that is out there that all defects will generate a recall.. simply not true. GM, or any OEM only has to recall items that are a safety issue. A blown engine is not a safety issue. The VW HPFP failures were legion, and the NHTSA did an extensive report, and confirmed it as a legitimate design issue.. yet because a sudden loss of power and broke car had not resulted in any accident, nor was assumed to be likely would result in an accident, they would not order a recall. Same applies here.
> What an OEM will do in a case such as this, would be a TSB, they might do a re-program of the ECU next service visit, or even extend the warranty on the particular item known to fail early, but it won't be a recall, and the absence of a recall is not an indication there is not a real design issue, or challenge in play.. it just means it's not safety related.
> 
> Hope that helps clear it up a bit.


Not everything has to be a safety issue for a recall.


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## MRO1791 (Sep 2, 2016)

snowwy66 said:


> Not everything has to be a safety issue for a recall.


 An OEM is free to issue a recall voluntarily if they choose, the NHTSA will not order one if it is not related to safety. It is rare for an OEM to offer a voluntary recall not related to safety.. sure, it is possible, but very unlikely. Recalls are horrible marketing and PR, and they would prefer more discreet ways to deal with problems.

Oh, an let me correct myself a bit.. emissions issues will also be recalled, due to compliance for regulations (EPA/CARB).. and those are not safety related. Compliance to regulations, be it safety, or emissions.. those will require recalls. I just want to be clear here. 

There were many other issues on other threads where people were asking for/or expecting recalls, one was short battery life for the Gen 1 Diesel, many assumed that would be cause for a recall, but since it was neither emissions nor safety issue.. there was no way a recall would come from that, unless it was a voluntarily action by the OEM.. that is just not a likely thing to happen.


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## MRO1791 (Sep 2, 2016)

BobJacobson said:


> How can you tell when a regen is happening? I drive like 95% highway but I'd really like to know if I end up in a situation like that so I can let It finish it's process.


Well the best way is a monitor like the Scan Guage 2, or the Snipesy Bi-scan for GM plug-in for Torque app on your phone, working with a bluetooth OBD2 reader... but there can be other ways. 

If you pay attention to MPG, you will notice a drop during regen due to fuel used to get up to temperature and to stay there. That is one way. Another is if you are in cruise control, you'll get subtle surging of the engine while on highway and in regen, this is not so subtle on my Cummins Dodge truck. 

Absent that, if you come to park, shut off the car, and the engine fan is running... well most cases, that is an interrupted regen right there.. but not too helpful at that point. 

Having said all that, if you drive like 95% highway.. you are not likely to have any problems, even if you do interupt an occasional regen, next drive it will heat up and continue to finish, no worries. It is the city driver who does less than 20 minute drives only, over many interruptions that you need to be worried. Not only does that lead to interrupts, it causes more frequent regens to begin with. With 95% highway, you should be seeing regens about every 500 to 700 miles, maybe even a 1000 miles apart. With mixes city/hwy, I see about 400-500 mile intervals, and more city I've seen as little as high 100s in my prior Gen 1 Diesel. 

The best news for you, with 95% highway.. you should have no problems, even if you pay no attention to regens. I have drives just over 20 minutes, mixed city and hwy, and for my drives it helps to pay attention.


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## MRO1791 (Sep 2, 2016)

BobJacobson said:


> How can you tell when a regen is happening? I drive like 95% highway but I'd really like to know if I end up in a situation like that so I can let It finish it's process.


Oh, I should add, regen or no.. it's good to allow a short engine cooldown before you shut it off, if you have a slow roll before park, that works fine.. if you come off an interstate and park right after.. a short period of idle helps take the high EGTs down, in areas like the turbo.. and can help prevent oil breakdown, and cool things off a bit if it is in a regen. This a bigger deal in my Gen 1, I've noticed the Gen 2 cools down much faster after I park, than did the Gen 1.. but Cast Iron block to Al.. that right there can account for much of that. EGTs during regen can exceed 1200 degrees, lock higher temperatures in the exhaust, then shut off the car.. oil stops moving.. and in some parts that temp will start to degrade some of the oil.. it's likely not a huge problem, but some of us have OCD about our cars, and their engines!


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## BobJacobson (Jan 10, 2018)

MRO1791 said:


> but some of us have OCD about our cars, and their engines!


I am very much OCD about my machinery. This is my first diesel, and modern diesel at that which is way more complicated than I had assumed. So along with educating myself about DPF DEF Regens and the like, I've been searching for the last 3 days trying to find out how exactly the grille shutters work. No one seems to know for sure which is driving me crazy.

At my job when they give me a manual for something I get all the details how and when something will work.... so not being able to find out really strikes a nerve haha

I have torque pro already and just looked up that biscan app. It says it only supports the Gen1 cars at the moment. Have you used it on a Gen2? 

Just want to make sure it works before I spend $35 on it.

Thanks for the quick reply appreciate the input. Luckily I currently live about 3 miles off the highway and I coast almost the whole way so it's a perfect cool down for the car,

I've only owned it a week or so but I love the thing, normally my cars are fast, I'm getting a completely different kind of enjoyment out of the way this car drives though. It's fantastic.


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## boraz (Aug 29, 2013)

snowwy66 said:


> Nope. I like the reliability of gas. Don't have to worry about glow plugs, fuel gel, clogged dpf, frozen def.
> 
> I drive semi's. That's enough deisel for me.


i drive diesel and worry aboot none of those, lol


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## boraz (Aug 29, 2013)

snowwy66 said:


> Dpf has been out 11 years now. Def 8 years. And they're not going away.
> 
> If you don't like em. Don't buy a diesel.
> 
> ...


diesel is cheaper here.
plus the extra mpg.

fuel filters, timing belt, delete will nibble away at savings, but its still a better driving car.

considering diesel equinox next yr


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## boraz (Aug 29, 2013)

snowwy66 said:


> There's 2 plus 1 car with piston failure. On this forum. And neither have absolutely anything to do with your statement. That's 3 cars that we know of. Out of how many millions out on the road.
> 
> Whatever caused those pistons to fail. It's more then likely a assembly flaw or design flaw. Or maybe operations problem from the owners driving habits. Although, I'd think that if it were a design flaw. There would have been a serious recall.
> 
> Nobody has posted yet as to why that 1 piston has failed. For all we know. They all went out to the tracks and raced.


millions of gen2 cars?


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## snowwy66 (Nov 5, 2017)

boraz said:


> millions of gen2 cars?


Yep. Millions of gen 2 cars. They're not just sold in america.


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## snowwy66 (Nov 5, 2017)

boraz said:


> i drive diesel and worry aboot none of those, lol


Nothing lasts forever. Everything breaks down. I"m guessing you live in a warmer climate which helps you compared to those in the north.


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## boraz (Aug 29, 2013)

snowwy66 said:


> Nothing lasts forever. Everything breaks down. I"m guessing you live in a warmer climate which helps you compared to those in the north.



im 8hrs north of the can/us border

so no, not warmer climate.


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## boraz (Aug 29, 2013)

snowwy66 said:


> Yep. Millions of gen 2 cars. They're not just sold in america.


yes, cuz fuel is the same in those countries.

OH WAIT.


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## MRO1791 (Sep 2, 2016)

BobJacobson said:


> I am very much OCD about my machinery. This is my first diesel, and modern diesel at that which is way more complicated than I had assumed. So along with educating myself about DPF DEF Regens and the like, I've been searching for the last 3 days trying to find out how exactly the grille shutters work. No one seems to know for sure which is driving me crazy.
> 
> At my job when they give me a manual for something I get all the details how and when something will work.... so not being able to find out really strikes a nerve haha
> 
> ...


The Bi-scan mostly works on Gen 2.. the PM (particulate mass) PID doesn't work, Transmission Temp doesn't work, and Regen status.. most of the other PIDs (these are the data codes to get specific information from the CAN bus/OBD 2 interface) do work. Snipesy is working on a newer program that is not out yet, but the $35 is still a deal for what the app can do, it can command a service regen, normal regen, and do many diagnostic functions that normally require a $600 plus scan tool.


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## grumpygy (Oct 20, 2016)

Well Have to add in up to about 60,000 only the tank heater was a problem now at 80,000 been in 3 times for the Particulate filter and my light just came on again for the same thing Starting to get a little tiring 2014 Cruze Diesel. Should still be covered since the last time in they extended the Warranty to cover it.


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## HondaTech2016 (Apr 20, 2017)

2017 Auto Sedan.
Almost 70k miles and only 2 CELs so far.

1st was a cracked DEF injector from factory @ 300 miles. 

2nd Grille shutters got frozen stuck in the winter and wouldnt actuate. Probably caused by the large puddle I drove through that morning and sat all day at work. Fixed themselves overnight. 

Mainly highway miles for me and she's been great!!!


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## firehawk618 (Feb 24, 2013)

Can't stand that guy. Anytime I accidentally click one of his videos it automatically gets a thumbs down!

28k miles on my 2018 and ONE check engine light. I pulled the codes. It was for an active grille shutter malfunction. That was right after a month of snow / freezing temps. The code went away and hasn't come back since.

LOVE the torque and relaxed feeling this car gives when cruising / accelerating.

I bought it for a commuter car. 104 miles round trip. 98% interstate. If this car were to get totaled out tomorrow I would search high and low to find another LOADED diesel hatch to replace it.


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## phil1734 (Aug 30, 2019)

I would bet good money that within the next 5-10 years gas cars (and eventually larger trucks) will have their own DPFs (really a GPF.)

They are already being phased in Europe, and a quick run of your finger around the exhaust tip of any direct injected engine will show you why.


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## MP81 (Jul 20, 2015)

Which means we can finally have non-fake exhaust tips again!

Or, just clean your exhaust tips.


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