# 1st Lapping night : Brakes !?



## Poje (Aug 2, 2012)

Yep, loved my 1st experience of Lappîng with my Cruze, great handling, engine push hard, tranny doing its job, but Brakes are gone after 5 laps. I have EBC slotted Discs, EBC Greenstuff pads and ATE super blue brake oil...

Conclusion : BBK ASAP.




P.S : I know i could try other Pads or do like that Racing Cruze and bring airflow to the Brakes with some tubing, but i dont want to spend another dime and not have the results i want, so BBK ftw.


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## Mick (Dec 31, 2011)

You're on an Ltz right? Make sure to take pics of the swap.

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## iKermit (Dec 13, 2010)

Call me shallow but it will look good... Lol

Do you have any videos?


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

If you subject your car to regular high-speed use like this, an auxiliary transmission cooler would become a great investment sooner rather than later. And change your fluid soon 

BTW, nothing's worse than coming into a 20 MPH corner at 85 MPH with cooked brakes. Been there, done that. Spun the car on the grass to avoid hitting a wall.


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## H3LLON3ARTH (Dec 16, 2011)

ZZPerformance - 12" Front Brake kit #ZZ-12BRKSNC


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## H3LLON3ARTH (Dec 16, 2011)

This is why i like Autocross.


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## Poje (Aug 2, 2012)

H3LLON3ARTH said:


> This is why i like Autocross.


Ya, in Autocross i had no troubles at all, but sadly, im now hooked on Lapping, lol.

BTW for those who didnt know, we have a warning on the Cruze : "Brake OVERHEAT" :goodjob:

As for the type of Brakes i'll put, prety sure it will be Baer, the same kit that was seen on the Tjin Cruze : 14" 2-piece rotors with 6 pistons calipers.


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## Poje (Aug 2, 2012)

iKermit said:


> Call me shallow but it will look good... Lol
> 
> Do you have any videos?


No videos yet, when im able to do a full 20min session w/o Brakes overheating, i'll record.

Pics of Brakes :


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## sciphi (Aug 26, 2011)

Good to know if I ever lap my Cruze.


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

Hmm, I wonder if that's a temp sensor in with the ABS sensors or just a brake fluid temp sensor? 


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## H3LLON3ARTH (Dec 16, 2011)

Poje said:


> Ya, in Autocross i had no troubles at all, but sadly, im now hooked on Lapping, lol.
> 
> BTW for those who didnt know, we have a warning on the Cruze : "Brake OVERHEAT" :goodjob:
> 
> As for the type of Brakes i'll put, prety sure it will be Baer, the same kit that was seen on the Tjin Cruze : 14" 2-piece rotors with 6 pistons calipers.


Did you locate this kit because IIRC it was a custom kit just for this car.

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## Blue Angel (Feb 18, 2011)

Poje said:


> Pics of Brakes :


I hate to burst your bubble, but those brakes won't fit in your 18" RS wheels. You'll probably need wheels that are designed for massive caliper clearance, just like the Rotiforms on that car. Get in touch with Baer and get a template:

Brake Template Instructions | www.Baer.com

EDIT: Here's a template for the 14" 6P kit:

http://www.baer.com/brake-templates/Q040P.PDF


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## Blue Angel (Feb 18, 2011)

H3LLON3ARTH said:


> ZZPerformance - 12" Front Brake kit #ZZ-12BRKSNC


This kit makes a LOT of sense, IMO. It looks like it's the same 2 piston sliding aluminum PBR caliper on my C5 Vette. Pad choice is unrivaled, and with a larger/thicker 12" rotor it will have much higher thermal limits than the OEM setup. It's probably all a Cruze needs for most track duty, I would think. No idea about the rear brakes, though... they might be your next stumbling block.


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## blk88verde (Apr 30, 2011)

> This kit makes a LOT of sense, IMO. It looks like it's the same 2 piston sliding aluminum PBR caliper on my C5 Vette. Pad choice is unrivaled, and with a larger/thicker 12" rotor it will have much higher thermal limits than the OEM setup. It's probably all a Cruze needs for most track duty, I would think


 When I need to replace my front brakes - I will likely go with this kit - seems reasonably priced.


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## H3LLON3ARTH (Dec 16, 2011)

blk88verde said:


> When I need to replace my front brakes - I will likely go with this kit - seems reasonably priced.


Yea $400 is damb reasonable 

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## Poje (Aug 2, 2012)

Blue Angel said:


> I hate to burst your bubble, but those brakes won't fit in your 18" RS wheels. You'll probably need wheels that are designed for massive caliper clearance, just like the Rotiforms on that car. Get in touch with Baer and get a template:
> 
> Brake Template Instructions | www.Baer.com
> 
> ...


They fit with my stock RS wheels, but i'll need wheel spacers, i'll see what size if i order them.


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## Poje (Aug 2, 2012)

jblackburn said:


> If you subject your car to regular high-speed use like this, an auxiliary transmission cooler would become a great investment sooner rather than later. And change your fluid soon
> 
> BTW, nothing's worse than coming into a 20 MPH corner at 85 MPH with cooked brakes. Been there, done that. Spun the car on the grass to avoid hitting a wall.


The Autobox on the Cruze has an oil cooler already and i change my fluids quite often.

I was lucky anough that my Brake problems began with the instructor beside me, lol, so we just continued to lap in a relax way so that the Brakes cool down and then continue.


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

Poje said:


> The Autobox on the Cruze has an oil cooler already and i change my fluids quite often.
> 
> I was lucky anough that my Brake problems began with the instructor beside me, lol, so we just continued to lap in a relax way so that the Brakes cool down and then continue.


It's not real. It's just a tube in the radiator, nothing more than a heat exchanger between the transmission fluid and engine coolant, like most other non-high performance cars. When more power than stock is pushed through such transmissions, it creates a lot of heat that the stock transfer system just can't handle well, which leads to burned fluid. Towing creates the same kind of heat stress on the transmission. 

An aux cooler would mount in front of the radiator or under the bumper, then tie into the feed line coming straight from the transmission. This way, the transmission fluid passes into the cooler first, then into the radiator "cooler" (actually just a heat exchanger) where it is warmed to a proper operating temp by the coolant for winter use.


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## Poje (Aug 2, 2012)

jblackburn said:


> It's not real. It's just a tube in the radiator, nothing more than a heat exchanger between the transmission fluid and engine coolant, like most other non-high performance cars. When more power than stock is pushed through such transmissions, it creates a lot of heat that the stock transfer system just can't handle well, which leads to burned fluid. Towing creates the same kind of heat stress on the transmission.
> 
> An aux cooler would mount in front of the radiator or under the bumper, then tie into the feed line coming straight from the transmission. This way, the transmission fluid passes into the cooler first, then into the radiator "cooler" (actually just a heat exchanger) where it is warmed to a proper operating temp by the coolant for winter use.


Sorry bro, we have an Oil cooler : http://www.newgmparts.com/parts/201...YSTEM&group=COOLING&subgroup=TRANS OIL COOLER


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## shawn672 (Oct 31, 2010)

Poje said:


> Sorry bro, we have an Oil cooler : http://www.newgmparts.com/parts/201...YSTEM&group=COOLING&subgroup=TRANS OIL COOLER


Poje is correct. It's small and weak, but it's there...


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## Blue Angel (Feb 18, 2011)

Poje said:


> They fit with my stock RS wheels, but i'll need wheel spacers, i'll see what size if i order them.


You've already tried the template inside your wheel? You should be able to get a rough idea of how thick a spacer you'll need just by playing with the template. Baer recommends a minimum of 0.100" clearance between all points of the wheel and caliper.


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## perlionex (Mar 10, 2011)

As an alternative, I notice the Chevrolet Cruze 2.0 VCDi (Diesel) has 300mm front brakes and 292mm rear brakes. Anybody know how we could order the calipers, mount, and rotors, and do a swap?


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## H3LLON3ARTH (Dec 16, 2011)

perlionex said:


> As an alternative, I notice the Chevrolet Cruze 2.0 VCDi (Diesel) has 300mm front brakes and 292mm rear brakes. Anybody know how we could order the calipers, mount, and rotors, and do a swap?


Easy asj one of our Australian buddies to ship us some lol.

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## Blue Angel (Feb 18, 2011)

H3LLON3ARTH said:


> Easy asj one of our Australian buddies to ship us some lol.


Bolt patterns, rotor hub diameters and spindles are all the same? It would make sense that they were all the same, but sometimes things just don't make sense...


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## Poje (Aug 2, 2012)

Im informing myself on the ZZP kit and if they answer my questions in a favorable way, i'll probably take it.

I would love the Baer kit for sure, but it would take more time to have the Cash and more time to get it shipped and installed.


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## Blue Angel (Feb 18, 2011)

Poje said:


> Im informing myself on the ZZP kit and if they answer my questions in a favorable way, i'll probably take it.


If you end up with the ZZP BBK, please take some pics of the hardware and let us know what you think of them. At $400 it seems like a very reasonable upgrade.

If they are the same PBR calipers the Corvette uses I can tell you first hand they work really well. The Vette guys who push them to extremes (fast tracks, race pads, 400-500 hp cars) have found their limits, but on a car with Cruze power levels they should be all you'll ever need.


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

shawn672 said:


> Poje is correct. It's small and weak, but it's there...


Whoops. Sweet...good to know.


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## Poje (Aug 2, 2012)

Blue Angel said:


> If you end up with the ZZP BBK, please take some pics of the hardware and let us know what you think of them. At $400 it seems like a very reasonable upgrade.
> 
> If they are the same PBR calipers the Corvette uses I can tell you first hand they work really well. The Vette guys who push them to extremes (fast tracks, race pads, 400-500 hp cars) have found their limits, but on a car with Cruze power levels they should be all you'll ever need.


From what ZZP told me, it seems to be Calipers from 2000 Camaro, at least for Pads replacement.

Of course i'll post plenty of pics, whatever the kit i choose.


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## Aussie (Sep 16, 2012)

Blue Angel said:


> Bolt patterns, rotor hub diameters and spindles are all the same? It would make sense that they were all the same, but sometimes things just don't make sense...


I read somewhere in Cruze Talk that the bolt spacing is different. Measuring between studs my diesel is 2 3/4" center to center, hope this helps?


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## perlionex (Mar 10, 2011)

Aussie said:


> I read somewhere in Cruze Talk that the bolt spacing is different. Measuring between studs my diesel is 2 3/4" center to center, hope this helps?


You're right, I think the 2.0L diesel is 5x115 whereas the petrol Cruzes are 5x105. I forgot about that! Guess it's back to either the ZZP kit or an off-the-shelf BBK as options for brake upgrades.


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## Blue Angel (Feb 18, 2011)

Poje said:


> From what ZZP told me, it seems to be Calipers from 2000 Camaro...


Yep, same calipers then. The only difference is mine say "Corvette" on them, but that doesn't make the car brake any better, it just adds ricepower.


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## Hoon (Mar 18, 2012)

jblackburn said:


> Whoops. Sweet...good to know.


I'm with you, i wouldn't trust a stock auto trans cooler for track duty unless i had a way to monitor temps. 

I've seen 255* engine oil temps just cruising on the highway, nevermind in a race situation. That might need to be addressed also.


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

Hoon said:


> I'm with you, i wouldn't trust a stock auto trans cooler for track duty unless i had a way to monitor temps.
> 
> I've seen 255* engine oil temps just cruising on the highway, nevermind in a race situation. That might need to be addressed also.


Aren't you running 5W-40 Rotella? That should the oil somewhat handle those high temps.

The "engine oil cooler" just looks to be a coolant jacket around the oil filter canister with a little heat sink on it. Meh.


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## Hoon (Mar 18, 2012)

jblackburn said:


> Aren't you running 5W-40 Rotella? That should the oil somewhat handle those high temps.
> 
> The "engine oil cooler" just looks to be a coolant jacket around the oil filter canister with a little heat sink on it. Meh.


Yeah i'm using Rotella. 

255 isnt really a concern, but that was in the winter and not towing. No idea what i'll see when i'm dragging bikes around in the summer.


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