# 15K Service Question?



## Tomko (Jun 1, 2013)

Personally I take the view that the car and its tires are best left in their factory state as long as possible - and until a problem with either balance or alignment is detected. 

My Cadillac is nine years old and has never had it's alignmnent touched. 

My Cruze has 55,000 miles on some pretty choppy roads and it's alignment and tire balance has never been touched. 

However, I have many times seen problems arise when perfectly good factory alignment and tire balance was adjusted by dealer technicians using unclaibrated equipment - to fix a problem that never existed in the first place.


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## Tomko (Jun 1, 2013)

I've also never had my dealership recommend a 15K or any other mileage based service package on any of my fleet.


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## Eddy Cruze (Jan 10, 2014)

I guess my question then would be, was I cheated if I had the wheels balanced without an alignment? Personally I would only do an an alignment if I needed one or purchased new tires.


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## Eddy Cruze (Jan 10, 2014)

Tomko said:


> I've also never had my dealership recommend a 15K or any other mileage based service package on any of my fleet.


That's funny you say that as every other Manufacturer hounds you on periodic services which can be quite costly while G.M. doesn't seem too. Of course to maintain the Warranty and the GMPP protection or any other VSC it is expected to follow some sort of schedule, especially in the deathly dusty desert


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## Tomko (Jun 1, 2013)

Eddy Cruze said:


> I guess my question then would be, was I cheated if I had the wheels balanced without an alignment? Personally I would only do an an alignment if I needed one or purchased new tires.


In my books the same thing goes for tire balance. 

I have an acquaintance of the female pursuasion whose slimeball foreign job dealership told her that she had to have her wheels rebalanced every year because the lead weights could rust. LOL!


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## Tomko (Jun 1, 2013)

Eddy Cruze said:


> That's funny you say that as every other Manufacturer hounds you on periodic services which can be quite costly while G.M. doesn't seem too. Of course to maintain the Warranty and the GMPP protection or any other VSC it is expected to follow some sort of schedule, especially in the deathly dusty desert


Services indeed need to be performed in accordance with the service schedule. Mostly changing fluids and filters. But what on earth did the 27 point inspection you received constitute and how does it compare with the service schedule?

My guess is that it's a method for the dealership to drum up some business. Maybe find something wrong that they could charge you or GMPP for. 

Certainly I get mailings from the dealership telling me that I need a spring or fall service - but this is just another form of advertising. It doesn't actually come from my service advisor. It comes from a third party direct marketing provider that the dealership owner subscribes to. For me it goes unopened and straight in the trash with the rest of the unsolicited mail that finds its way into my mailbox. I get the same crap about how they have a buyer just for my year and model of Cadillac, etc. I call bull$hit on that too because there's a halfdozen of them in the autotrader right now. 

So, in summary, no I have never had my service advisor propose such a service package to my face. 

As well, I understand that you're in a different environment than me - but I'm guessing that mine's equally harsh if not moreso.


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## Eddy Cruze (Jan 10, 2014)

Interesting! I have only owned new Cars that must be serviced every 90 days or 3000 miles. The 27 point inspection is free and is done with all LOF services. There is added value in this paperwork/inspection but again remember, its FREE!

As a rule Dealers will not poke around your Car looking for warranty work to do. Unless you complain about a certain component they are not allowed to look for additional work. The only exception would be a safety concern and even then...


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## dhpnet (Mar 2, 2014)

I follow the maintenance schedule for any services listed, and the owners manual for additional inspections. Tire rotation and balance are not regular service items and are not listed on the maintenance schedule. If I feel a vibration then I will have the wheel balance checked, otherwise I leave it alone. If I notice any signs of wheels out of alignment then I have the alignment checked, otherwise I leave it alone. No reason to pay for services you don't need. 

Your bill doesn't look too bad. $140 for a full synthetic oil change, both air filters changed and a 5 minute inspection is a little high, but not bad. I would ask them to list all the items inspected on the receipt with a report of the condition of each inspection point. Without documentation of the exact inspections and the results then nothing was inspected, in my opinion. The quick oil change place by my house includes that report. 

How many miles do you have? The passenger air filter is supposed to be changed every 22.5K miles and the engine air filter is supposed to be changed every 45K miles using the severe conditions maintenance schedule in the owners manual.


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## dhpnet (Mar 2, 2014)

Eddy Cruze said:


> As a rule Dealers will not poke around your Car looking for warranty work to do. Unless you complain about a certain component they are not allowed to look for additional work. The only exception would be a safety concern and even then...


You can pay for additional inspections. I usually do this before my warranty expires. But, I require them to list the items inspected and the condition on the receipt.


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## Eddy Cruze (Jan 10, 2014)

So you don't get mailers with service coupons in Canada? I have read that the Service Bay at your Dealership is more profitable than from the sales of new Cars. We get these targeted offers all the time. It is funny, I asked my Service Writer about this service, he did not try to push it on me by any means, and I've got these type of offers for the past 40 years. One thing I didn't like, they were waiting for the Air Filter to be brought over from the store. We go to the Dealer for OEM parts & they charge for OEM parts


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## Eddy Cruze (Jan 10, 2014)

dhpnet said:


> I follow the maintenance schedule for any services listed, and the owners manual for additional inspections. Tire rotation and balance are not regular service items and are not listed on the maintenance schedule. If I feel a vibration then I will have the wheel balance checked, otherwise I leave it alone. If I notice any signs of wheels out of alignment then I have the alignment checked, otherwise I leave it alone. No reason to pay for services you don't need.
> 
> Your bill doesn't look too bad. $140 for a full synthetic oil change, both air filters changed and a 5 minute inspection is a little high, but not bad. I would ask them to list all the items inspected on the receipt with a report of the condition of each inspection point. Without documentation of the exact inspections and the results then nothing was inspected, in my opinion. The quick oil change place by my house includes that report.
> 
> How many miles do you have? The passenger air filter is supposed to be changed every 22.5K miles and the engine air filter is supposed to be changed every 45K miles using the severe conditions maintenance schedule in the owners manual.


I didn't even notice it was full synthetic. I did notice that the $39.95 Dexos Blend Oil change available all last year is now $49.95 and it might be the full synthetic. I agree with everything you and Tomko have said. The price of this offer was most certainly reasonable and with 14,000 miles on the CRUZE I didn't need an Alignment, and I am sure with no tire wear or vibration I didn't need my wheels rebalanced either. We see incredible dust out here so considering all they did, along with that multi point inspection sheet found everywhere (some with more multi points!), I feel that the price was fair, albeit possibly unnecessary.


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

I didn't have an alignment done until I had new tires put on at 30-35K or so. Usually don't before a new set of tires unless I see odd signs of tire wear or the car seems to pull in one direction. Often they'll check for you for free to tell you whether or not it's within spec. My Cruze held its alignment very well despite our pothole-ridden roads and my adventures down gravel roads.


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## Eddy Cruze (Jan 10, 2014)

I did want to mention it wasn't the 14K I was necessarily following but *3* years of the CRUZE in service in 125 degree summer dusty weather. Do you have a minute to see a Desert dust storm in action, incredible


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## Merc6 (Jun 8, 2013)

Eddy Cruze said:


> Just got back from the Dealership. Had a $129 coupon for the 15K Service. It was to include an alignment. Instead it was a rotate & *balance* all 4 wheels which makes more sense to me. What is your feeling on this, was the alignment or the balancing even necessary?
> View attachment 215906


Oil Filter | Genuine GM | 55594651 : GM Parts Direct: Your direct source for Genuine GM Parts
$5.69 Vs. Dealer $6.00 Vs Wally World Fram $14 and my ex Dealer $17.00
Oil | Genuine GM | 88865639 : GM Parts Direct: Your direct source for Genuine GM Parts
$10.88 X 5 Vs. Dealer $3.75 X 5
Cabin Air Filter | Genuine GM | 13271190 : GM Parts Direct: Your direct source for Genuine GM Parts
$14.26 Vs. Dealer $32.99 and and Wally World $12.99
Filter for 2013 Chevrolet Cruze|13272719 : GM Parts Direct: Your direct source for Genuine GM Parts
$13.03 Vs Dealer $34.99 and Wally World $12.99


How many miles on the car and what year again? In theory the service may have been BS for the miles but it was fairly cheap for what they did if they actually replaced all those items beyond the oil and oil filter. Here that easily could have been a $300 job ticket. I'm away from my receipts but I can find them 8 AM EST when I get off work and see. Depending on the year, they probably should have suggested brake fluid. Now that I think about it, my dealer checks alignment before they even get the car into service bay and print it out for you while you wait for the service writer to finish his/her paperwork for you to sign. 

My ex Dealer 4 tire rotation and oil change is $49.95 if I used their oil and filter. I usually just handed them my Amsoil SS since tire rotation was like $35 and oil change with my oil was $19 and change if you tried to break it down. 

Subaru cabin air filter is a $90 process alone

Cabin and engine air filter is kinda over the top but expected in a dealer parts bin.


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## Eddy Cruze (Jan 10, 2014)

Merc6 said:


> Oil Filter | Genuine GM | 55594651 : GM Parts Direct: Your direct source for Genuine GM Parts
> $5.69 Vs. Dealer $6.00 Vs Wally World Fram $14 and my ex Dealer $17.00
> Oil | Genuine GM | 88865639 : GM Parts Direct: Your direct source for Genuine GM Parts
> $10.88 X 5 Vs. Dealer $3.75 X 5
> ...


This is a great Chevy Dealership, let me make that clear. The Cruze has about 14K on it over 3 treacherous years. I was a little miffed about the aftermarket filter used today but its common practice. I drew the line at a Hyundai Dealership when they sold me some parts at the Counter as OEM parts right from their bulk bin. The Parts Manager did apologize as he told me those were used for service only, not for retail. Still you expect OEM filters and other common parts used in your Dealer servicing and many times they're not. I was thinking of complaining but as I mentioned I like this Dealer, I need this Dealer (the only one in 60 miles) and they did do the work. My tires were fine, perhaps now they're even better. I would be interested in why my service would be so costly in Cleveland and why you were paying so much for a LOF even after providing them the Oil? I too feel like my Dealer did a ton of work today, although it was not the same exact work I thought I bought. Instead of a LOF with blended oil I got full synthetic oil (a first for me). Instead of a Cabin air filter change I got a Cabin filter change *and* an Engine air filter change! Instead of a rotation (included in the LOF) and a full alignment I received a rotation and the wheels balanced. I even got them to over fill the tires to 38 PSI, something Dealers generally don't do for you. They didn't wash it this time but usually do a crappy job anyway so I'll get it cleaned another day, after it rains (California is Flooding!)


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## Merc6 (Jun 8, 2013)

Eddy Cruze said:


> This is a great Chevy Dealership, let me make that clear. The Cruze has about 14K on it over 3 treacherous years. I was a little miffed about the aftermarket filter used today but its common practice. I drew the line at a Hyundai Dealership when they sold me some parts at the Counter as OEM parts right from their bulk bin. The Parts Manager did apologize as he told me those were used for service only, not for retail. Still you expect OEM filters and other common parts used in your Dealer servicing and many times they're not. I was thinking of complaining but as I mentioned I like this Dealer, I need this Dealer (the only one in 60 miles) and they did do the work. My tires were fine, perhaps now they're even better. I would be interested in why my service would be so costly in Cleveland and why you were paying so much for a LOF even after providing them the Oil? I too feel like my Dealer did a ton of work today, although it was not the same exact work I thought I bought. Instead of a LOF with blended oil I got full synthetic oil (a first for me). Instead of a Cabin air filter change I got a Cabin filter change *and* an Engine air filter change! Instead of a rotation (included in the LOF) and a full alignment I received a rotation and the wheels balanced. I even got them to over fill the tires to 38 PSI, something Dealers generally don't do for you. They didn't wash it this time but usually do a crappy job anyway so I'll get it cleaned another day, after it rains (California is Flooding!)



_My ex Dealer 4 tire rotation and oil change is $49.95 

__Tire rotation was like $35 on it's own

__Oil change with my oil was $19 and change

__$35 plus like $20 is $55 before tax if you separated it out._


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## Eddy Cruze (Jan 10, 2014)

I'm dying to find out why you feel my 3 year/15K service would have cost so much in your town? I can't be too upset about the alignment because my alignment seemed great. I can't get too worked up about aftermarket parts represented as OEM parts because that is the way the world works!

I would have thought your Chevy dealer would have charged you no more than last years national $39.95 (or less) for an Oil Change, Filter, Rotation & Multi point inspection, even if you didn't take their crappy blended oil


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## Merc6 (Jun 8, 2013)

Eddy Cruze said:


> I'm dying to find out why you feel my 3 year/15K service would have cost so much in your town? I can't be too upset about the alignment because my alignment seemed great. I can't get too worked up about aftermarket parts represented as OEM parts because that is the way the world works!
> 
> I would have thought your Chevy dealer would have charged you no more than last years national $39.95 (or less) for an Oil Change, Filter, Rotation & Multi point inspection, even if you didn't take their crappy blended oil


This year it looks like they changed the prices and it's up to 6 qts vs the 5 of last years. I had brand new tires put on a week before the last oil change so I didn't pay the $49.95 or even notice the change untill I went to their website. 

Your coupon attachment on top of this page looks identical but a few pennies less for the same oil and rotation services.


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## diesel (Jun 8, 2013)

Seems like a reasonable deal for a 3 year service, for a car that covered hot and dusty miles. I'd say it was worth it, and now you're good for another 3 years. As for alignment and balance, I only get these done if I need to, i.e. shimmies on the highway, or uneven wear on the tires.


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## spacedout (Dec 7, 2010)

Just follow the Maintenance schedule in the back on the owners manual, don't be tricked into fake services you don't need. I bought my sonic this April with 9K on the clock, just past 37K earlier this week. only maintenance I had was oil changes over that time, and I had the alignment checked when I had new tires put on at 33K.


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## obermd (Mar 3, 2012)

I use the severe service guide in the 2014 owners manual except for tires, balancing, and alignment. I rotate and balance every 5000 miles and align after I replace the tires if the old tires show alignment problems.


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## winks79 (Dec 20, 2013)

Unless tires are wearing unevenly, (wear more on the outside of one and inside of the other), or car is pulling to one side, there is never a need for alignment, even when purchasing new tires. Heck, I've owned 38 vehicles in the last 32 years, and never had an alignment done on any of my vehicles. Some of these have had well over 100k miles put on them also. I have a 93' GMC Sierra, bought new, and still on the factory alignment. The '79 Trans Am in my profile is still on the factory alignment. Only if you had front end parts replaced would it be absolutely necessary. As for balancing, never had a re-balance done on any of my tires, especially with tires that came from factory. They seem to be the best balanced tires that you will ever have. I rotate my own tires, and have really never had an issue where any of my tires needed a re-balance. If you do not have a vibration, no re-balance needed. To each there own, but it is really just a waste of money, unless you have wrecked the car, or jumped some ditches, curbs, etc., that might cause the car to be out of alignment. If you just inspect your tires from time to time, they will tell you if it needs alignment or not. I rotate my tires every oil change, which is 5k miles for me. I do a complete check of the whole car during this time, brakes, suspension parts, oil leaks, check tire pressures, and such. Don't need a mechanic to tell me stuff like that. But I do understand that some may not have a place to do this, or even know how, and that is fine, but don't let the dealership take you for a ride either. Believe me, some will try to take advantage of you, and are not always honest about the services they say they performed. I always tell people, if you get service at the dealership, and they replace parts, ask them after service is done to see the old parts that were replaced. But even that is not a sure way to know, unless you saw them remove the parts, could have come off another vehicle that they had worked on. I've seen this happen with my sister-in-law at a Honda dealership. Bought a new '13 Odyssey, went in for one of her free oil changes at 5k miles, told them only wanted the oil changed and a tire rotation. She was suppose to pay only the tax on the cost of the oil change/tire rotation, (less than $5). Keep in mind the vehicle only had about 5k miles on it. Told her it was ready, and went to pay bill. Bill was over $80. They had charged her for a cabin filter, engine air filter, brake inspection, and some other crazy items. She told them it only had 5k miles on it and it did not need those things, nor did she ask for them. She asked them to show her the filters that came off her vehicle. Took them about 20 minutes to bring them to her. She said they looked terrible, and full of dirt. She knew they did not come out of her vehicle, it was brand new and never been driven down a dirt road. They had went a dug them up out of the trash or something. Needless to say, she did not pay for any of it, and never went back. Some will try to take advantage of you, especially if they think you don't know better.


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## Eddy Cruze (Jan 10, 2014)

spacedout said:


> Just follow the Maintenance schedule in the back on the owners manual, don't be tricked into fake services you don't need. I bought my sonic this April with 9K on the clock, just past 37K earlier this week. only maintenance I had was oil changes over that time, and I had the alignment checked when I had new tires put on at 33K.


One Oil change with 37K, never. This is the last time I order one of these periodic services and all the comments posted here were excellent, thank you all. I only spent $129 as we know, had a lot of stuff done and the only thing that irked me is the tripled selling price on an aftermarket item. Is this normal in the Business, well yes. Heard from my Dealer this morning:

_*"Hello Gomer,

The alignment was not included in the 15k and usually the service that was performed on your vehicle would amount to $169.96 plus tax. If I said it was included I apologize. The alignment machine is down at this time and they are planning on replacing it. After we get the new machine I would like you to come back in to have the alignment completed at no charge and at that time we will have it cleaned as well. Please let me know if this will be ok with you but I am not sure how long it will take to get the new machine. Thank you again for your business and I look forward to hearing from you"
*_


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## Tomko (Jun 1, 2013)

Well certainly better to have your alignment done on a new machine and not an old one. 

My first question for any technician suggesting an alignment is: When was your alignment rack last calibrated by the manufacturer?

If the answer is anything more than six months then it's time to find someone else.


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## spacedout (Dec 7, 2010)

Eddy Cruze said:


> One Oil change with 37K, never.


Please re-read my post, I said oil Change*'s'*. I had the oil changed day one when I picked it up at 9K, then average about every 6000 miles or 2 months for each proceeding oil change. In the Last 10 months I've had 5 oil changes done.

Again just read the maintenance schedule in the back of your owners manual, if its not listed the dealer is just trying to empty your pocket. There is NO maintenance besides oil changes listed until after 45,000 miles. At that point you will need an air filter and get the automatic transmission fluid changed.


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## Eddy Cruze (Jan 10, 2014)

spacedout said:


> There is NO maintenance besides oil changes listed until after 45,000 miles. At that point you will need an air filter and get the automatic transmission fluid changed.


Well there is the cabin Filter at 22.5K and rotations every 7.5K but you're right. Changing the cabin filter can only help keeping the CRUZE smelling fresh, remember this was a 3 year service I had done. Plus now I have an alignment waiting for me free in the future


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## spacedout (Dec 7, 2010)

Eddy Cruze said:


> Well there is the cabin Filter at 22.5K and rotations every 7.5K but you're right.


I forgot about the cabin filter, I typically change mine every fall. Its very easy to change yourself, and 1/3 the price the dealer charges. Think I typically buy mine on amazon for $10. I find more leaves blocking mine than anything, if you live in the desert I would suspect you could probably just dump out the sand and keep using the same one.


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## Eddy Cruze (Jan 10, 2014)

spacedout said:


> I forgot about the cabin filter, I typically change mine every fall. Its very easy to change yourself, and 1/3 the price the dealer charges. Think I typically buy mine on amazon for $10. I find more leaves blocking mine than anything, if you live in the desert I would suspect you could probably just dump out the sand and keep using the same one.


Yes the mechanic showed me the filter(s) and I've seen worse but he did mention there was a bunch of dirt that he blew out. If I knew they were going to call the auto parts store for a filter I would have brought mine in, it was like $12.99 on eBay


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## Merc6 (Jun 8, 2013)

My filter was horrible after 8 months. I usually do 3 a year due to the high pollen. Once I figure out the Accord same will happen for it.


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## Eddy Cruze (Jan 10, 2014)

Yuck, all I had was 2 Crickets and some minor dirt. 3 a year wow. Where do you find that amount of debris?


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## Tomko (Jun 1, 2013)

I'm guessing you run your fan at higher speeds. 

I never go over four and mostly run it at one.


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

Tomko said:


> I'm guessing you run your fan at higher speeds.
> 
> I never go over four and mostly run it at one.


You people and your 6 well-sorted fan speeds...


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## Merc6 (Jun 8, 2013)

Eddy Cruze said:


> Yuck, all I had was 2 Crickets and some minor dirt. 3 a year wow. Where do you find that amount of debris?





Tomko said:


> I'm guessing you run your fan at higher speeds.
> 
> I never go over four and mostly run it at one.


LOL, pollen means I like never ever ever ever have my windows down in the summer because pollen would cover every bit of the interior and attack me. My city also has lots of trees, to the point the city logo is trees. So much forest I walk out of the house and have deer blocking me from my car.


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## Eddy Cruze (Jan 10, 2014)

Hey as a Post Script to this concern and I again thank all of you for the helpful responses I got the Dealer Survey and did not hesitate to give them all 5's, now my next Oil change (full synthetic) is FREE!


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