# GM installed Pioneer system



## one unhappy GM customer (Aug 13, 2013)

Can't keep the rear sub's in the car. About to go back to the dealership for my 3rd set. Anyone else have this problem? Also having volume issues. My stereo max volume is 45. It seems that after the low 30's it doesn't get any louder as the number increases. Also, Bass is super heavy. I usually run it @ 0 to -2 and it's still overpowering. Thanks!


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## Mike220 (Jan 5, 2011)

Nearly 50k on my cruze with pioneer system and I haven't had any issues. I turn the bass down pretty far I don't recall what it is off hand but I believe -3 to -5 ish. Also try the different settings like rock, country, jazz etc if not go custom.


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## sciphi (Aug 26, 2011)

Yeah, the Pioneer "upgrade" is really a downgrade from the base system. Use the search in the upper right corner of the forum. The Pioneer system has been discussed in detail many times.


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## tecollins1 (Nov 6, 2011)

You don't want to go over 30 anyways.
The head unit is clipping past that, and clipping is bad. 


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## BowtieGuy (Jan 4, 2013)

I have the Pioneer system as well, and after adjusting it, I think it is worth the upgrade over the stock radio. _IF_ you take the time to tune it. *Note:* I listen to classic rock/rock mainly, so slight adjustments to your Bass/Mid/Treble may be necessary depending on your music preference, but the fade should be the same.
My settings are:
Bass: +3 clicks from the bottom
Mid: dead center (no adjustment)
Treble: +2 clicks from middle position
Fade: -6 clicks from middle position (towards rear)


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## mcg75 (Mar 5, 2012)

If somebody needs to hit 30 to hear the pioneer system, they need their hearing checked not a louder system.


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## Devilz (May 16, 2012)

mcg75 said:


> If somebody needs to hit 30 to hear the pioneer system, they need their hearing checked not a louder system.


+1

agree


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## RollinOn18s (Mar 28, 2013)

I don't agree. I listen steady over 30 and if you think that's loud enough you're too old to be commenting. 
The pioneer stereo is awful and I regret it everytime I am in my car.


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## Merc6 (Jun 8, 2013)

LOL, windows down under 30 is useless at speeds 30 and up. Also what is your source of audio? AM/FM CD XM Bluetooth USB AUX?


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## mcg75 (Mar 5, 2012)

RollinOn18s said:


> I don't agree. I listen steady over 30 and if you think that's loud enough you're too old to be commenting.
> The pioneer stereo is awful and I regret it everytime I am in my car.


30 puts out music at 90-95 decibels in my Cruze. Repeated exposure to noise 85 decibels or higher results in hearing loss. Not an opinion, that's a fact. 

Noise-Induced Hearing Loss

You want to go deaf, go right ahead but don't tell me where I can or can't comment. Thanks.


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## stevesjh (Aug 29, 2011)

It's a piece of crap as I have been stating since I bought my 2012 Cruze in 2011. GM wont do anything about it. Believe me I tried. It will take about $500.00 to $700.00 to get it right. Would have had it done by now but I lost my job 6 months after I got the car.


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## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

For the insane price premium, the Pioneer system really is complete garbage. The only thing you really get out of it is a center channel speaker (which doesn't really do a whole lot of good), and the rear 6x9 subs. The door speakers are supposedly different, but the rear door speakers are set up awkwardly and make it difficult to get any reasonable level of sound quality out of them. 

The system has limitations. Don't be fooled into believing that just because you turn up the volume, your bass will get louder. These drivers are designed to be very efficient. that in turn results in a lower distortion threshold and a lower power handling. If you drive them hard for extended periods of time, you will break them. They cheap quality and the sound they put out definitely reflects that. 

I tell everyone who asks about the Pioneer system that if you want a better sounding system, use that same money on upgrades to the base system and you will be a lot happier in the end. The Pioneer bass is boomy and nonlinear, and the adjustments will only fix the issues with certain types of music. This is likely why some people hate it and others are fine with it. 

As for hearing loss, I'd appreciate it if people refrained from commenting until they've done their research and presented the situation factually. The notion is that anything over 85 dB can cause hearing loss. Of course, people neglect to mention that you need *over 8 hours* of constant exposure to cause hearing loss. The fact is that up to 8 hours (generally speaking) of noise at 85 dB is perfectly safe. 

The following will put this into perspective for you:
Decibel (Loudness) Comparison Chart

It is worth noting here the chart on daily permissible exposure. Also copied from another source:


16 hours for 80 dBA sound
8 hours for 85 dBA sound
4 hours for 90 dBA sound
2 hours for 95 dBA sound
1 hour for 100 dBA sound
30 min for 105 dBA sound
15 min for 110 dBA sound
7.5 min for 115 dBA sound
0 min for above 115 dBA sound (there should be no exposure at this level!)

So let's think about this for a second. I can actually run my circular, sliding miter, or table saw while cutting wood, for *fifteen minutes straight* and be within the "safe and recommended" exposure period with no hearing loss. We also know from general perception of sound output that every 10db increase "sounds" twice as loud, and every 20db increase sounds about 4x as loud. 

What you guys don't know is that audio is not a sustained signal. There are peaks, and dips, and something called crest factor. My two 18" subs can take me up to ~130-135db, but I don't sit in my car with my subs at the limits of their excursion playing clips of sine waves.


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## mcg75 (Mar 5, 2012)

One chart doesn't fit everybody. Some people are more susceptible than others and noise induced hearing loss is also cumulative. Running your table saw for 15 minutes causes such minimal damage that it would never effect the average person. Try running it 15 minutes every hour as a job and things will turn out very differently. My boss is a victim of NIHL. 25 years of using air impact tools now has him with the hearing of a 60 year old according to his audiologist. And every one of those air impact tools has a "safe zone" yet we don't run them anywhere near as long as the supposed "safe zone." But once again we come to "cumulative" as the key word. 



> As has been mentioned several times, individual susceptibility to NIHL is highly variable. Several large studies have been done which have shown that, on average, 5% of individuals with long-term exposure to noise levels of 80dBA will have significant hearing loss. This risk increases to 5-15% with 85dBA noise and 15-25% with 90dBA noise (1). These averages are useful in terms of counseling patients on the risks of noise exposure, but we do not have a good understanding why, within a population exposed to the same noise intensity for the same time period, some individuals will have a significant reduction in hearing thresholds and others will not. Studies have evaluated the relationship between such things as gender, race, eye-color, other medical conditions or smoking history and susceptibility to noise but have not been able to demonstrate a connection (9). Attempts have also been made to predict the likelihood of a PTS based upon the degree of TTS after a noise exposure. Again, no such association has been proven (5).


Noise Induced Hearing Loss

It basically boils down to this because I'm not interested in arguing. Everybody is free to do whatever they want in regards to protecting their own hearing. Personally, since I have already tested my Cruze at the 30 setting and had an average of 90 decibels with peaks at 95ish, I'll listen to it a little lower just in case I happen to be one of those more susceptible people. Because if I am, by the time I realize it, it's already too late.


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## BowtieGuy (Jan 4, 2013)

The Cruze is an economy car. Expecting $450 to blow your pants off sound wise is an unrealistic given what the car is. I personally enjoy the Pioneer system in my Cruze, and feel that now that it is dialed in where I want it, the upgrade over stock for not having to run wires/tear off my door panels in a brand new car was well worth it. It is a compact, not a luxury car like an Aston with the B&O system. Once you accept it for what it is, you can get on with enjoying it. JMO.


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## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

mcg75 said:


> One chart doesn't fit everybody. Some people are more susceptible than others and noise induced hearing loss is also cumulative. Running your table saw for 15 minutes causes such minimal damage that it would never effect the average person. Try running it 15 minutes every hour as a job and things will turn out very differently. My boss is a victim of NIHL. 25 years of using air impact tools now has him with the hearing of a 60 year old according to his audiologist. And every one of those air impact tools has a "safe zone" yet we don't run them anywhere near as long as the supposed "safe zone." But once again we come to "cumulative" as the key word.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


No doubt, if this was my job, I would be wearing hearing protection on a regular basis. Believe me when I say that I value my hearing more than most people. The fear of losing hearing is bad enough, but through my time designing and voicing home theater speakers, I have trained my ears to hear quite a bit. I can't afford to risk that. My understanding is that the numbers I posted above are a daily exposure. 

Your boss should have worn hearing protection. I don't even mess around with that kind of thing.


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## au201 (May 18, 2013)

How many speakers is the pioneer system? And how much was it to add to the car? The equinox I drive has a 9 speaker pioneer system from factory and rock and metal core music sound awesome. Bass on +5 to +7, everything else on 0. It sounds a tiny bit better than the Bose 9 speaker system in my camaro. But I have a feeling cruze and equinox aren't the same pioneer systems. 


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