# Clutch pedal went to floor



## lbkNhubert (May 18, 2017)

I had it happen to me. It took three failures until the dealer bit the bullet, pulled the transmission, and replaced the slave cylinder. Insist that they replace it, or there are high odds that it will fail again down the line.


----------



## CRUISE-CRUZE (Nov 8, 2010)

I think it may be the pressure plate...


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

CRUISE-CRUZE said:


> I think it may be the pressure plate...


That would be crazy... I am very gentle and deliberate driver, I know what kills clutches and I don't do those things. I have owned five manual transmission cars since the 1970s, and only one automatic for two years in all this time. I have never had to replace a clutch in a car I've owned (until, maybe, this one at 20,500 miles!), and the two (Japanese sedans) I've driven to high mileages, have with their 2nd owners (people I know) gone well over 200,000 miles without ever replacing the clutch.


----------



## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

Sure sign the slave cyl is on its way out...just what you were trying to avoid with the fluid changes, etc IIRC.

Figure out how you can duplicate it, if possible, and drop it off in the service bay requesting a tech to look at it happening. Or shoot a video and email to the service advisor to send to the tech.

Communication/duplicating the issues with my Gen 1's transmission were a huge pain in the whole process.


----------



## SilveradoWTRT (May 10, 2020)

Should definitely get GM to take care of it. Also should report to NHTSA so maybe an investigation will happen and maybe a recall.


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

Reported to NHTSA. Just left the car at the dealer. Currently, drives OK after pumping it up before starting. Service advisor says they will 'look for leaks'. The 16 hours or so between now & tomorrow, should demonstrate the issue.


----------



## SilveradoWTRT (May 10, 2020)

That’s good. I have an 18 manual Trans with 28k miles. Really hoping that it either fails sooner rather than later so it will be warranty or for a recall. Don’t particularly want to pay for such a repair.


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

They looked at it today & saw it was leaking into the bell housing. Will take it apart tomorrow & if it's the release bearing they will warranty repair. If I understand correctly.


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

Not covered under warranty. >$2100.


----------



## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

17Hatch6MT said:


> Not covered under warranty. >$2100.


What's their reasoning for that?


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

Service advisor 'called GM and was told it was not covered. He looked it up & indeed, the clutch release bearing is not part of the powertrain warranty.' I am looking through my docs right now... the owner's manual that I downloaded does not have a warranty page, and the paper owner's manual is with the car that's now at the dealership. 

I told them to go ahead & repair it, has to be done.


----------



## SilveradoWTRT (May 10, 2020)

So, it’s not the slave cylinder?


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

There is no mention of warranty in any of the documents I have here at home.

Yes, I believe it is the slave cylinder. I believe it's integral with the release bearing, an all-in-1 part. Not sure about all that.


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

The slave cylinder is mentioned as covered in the 2020 Warranty Book. Is this what my 2017 Warranty Book also says?


----------



## SilveradoWTRT (May 10, 2020)

Sounds like the dealer may have misdiagnosed this as the clutch release bearing instead of the slave cylinder.


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

I think the release bearing and slave cylinder are an inseperable, integral assemblage.


----------



## SilveradoWTRT (May 10, 2020)

If that’s the case then it should be covered for warranty. It specially stated slave cylinder so if these parts are one unit then the slave cylinder failed which is covered by warranty.


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

Your description of the problem is common to basically every manual transmission owner of 2nd gen cars. The slave cylinders fail and cause problems.

The slave cylinder is covered under warranty. Do not budge from that.


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

Here is the GM TSB detailing the warranty coverage.


----------



## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

Do you have a rental while yours is there? That’s a LOT of money for something that GM has released TSBs about and is part of an integral assembly known for failure.

Get GM Customer Care involved or tell the dealer they need to call their warranty dept again and double check.


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

Thank you, @jblackburn , will do. Getting by on bicycle for now. Lot of money in any case... they're not replacing the entire clutch, just the slave cyl and (since it's a single assembly) the release bearing and I don't know what else, maybe what's in the bulletin. Online sources place the expected price for a clutch at $1200-$1500. Service advisor said book hours for this was 15 hours ??!


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

Opened a case with Chevrolet Customer Assistance. Word is, will get 'some help'. I am told I will hear more on Tuesday.


----------



## Iamantman (Sep 24, 2018)

Yikes. Yeah don't let this slip. They don't want to eat it, because money, but this sure seems like it aught to be covered. It's an internal transaxle component which is part of your powertrain. The warranty explicitly states the clutch and pressure plate are not covered because they are wear items but I'd think everything else short of wiring should be covered.


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

Iamantman said:


> The warranty explicitly states the clutch and pressure plate are not covered because they are wear items


This failure does not point to the clutch and/or pressure plate being the problem. I'd only accept that they failed if the dealership opened up the transmission and can point to the parts being bad.

If they are indeed bad but it's still a failed slave cylinder, GM owes you all the standard labor costs as part of the warranty. Sure, it's extra labor to remove the old pressure plate and then install it (and the cost of the new pressure plate), but that's all you should be billed. If it costs GM $2,000 to disassemble the transmission for their warranty work and it's an extra $100 + a $50 part for something not under warranty, you owe them $150 out of your pocket for that.

Depending on if the clutch is anything other than brand spanking new when inspected, it's worth having the mechanic put a new clutch plate in there to have a new part if the cost is low enough.


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

Called the service advisor, was told the 'help' would involve cutting the price in half to ~$1100. Still sucks for a problem that's supposedly covered under warranty.


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

17Hatch6MT said:


> Called the service advisor, was told the 'help' would involve cutting the price in half to ~$1100. Still sucks for a problem that's supposedly covered under warranty.


Stick to your warranty benefits as explained in the book in the car. The slave cylinder is failing or failed as per that TSB, and they owe you the repair under warranty.

Worst case: pay for the repair and then take them to small claims court (as I am doing right now with my car).


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

Let us know how that goes. I saw a Steve Lehto (Lemon Law att'y in Michigan) video & I think he said such suits are usually unsuccessful. Best of luck to you.


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

17Hatch6MT said:


> such suits are usually unsuccessful


It's small claims court. It's an argument over about $800. Do you think GM wants to pay their lawyer to schlep down to Central Illinois to argue with me over $800? The travel expenses and per diem of any lawyer are going to cost more than that. They'll settle.


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

Barry Allen said:


> It's small claims court. It's an argument over about $800. Do you think GM wants to pay their lawyer to schlep down to Central Illinois to argue with me over $800? The travel expenses and per diem of any lawyer are going to cost more than that. They'll settle.


No, they don't want to quibble over a single $800 claim. What they want is not to face a kabillion $800 claims, so they'll contest every last one.


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

17Hatch6MT said:


> No, they don't want to quibble over a single $800 claim. What they want is not to face a kabillion $800 claims, so they'll contest every last one.


True, but the odds are stacked against them. Small claims is relatively lax as it is the layperson's access to quick settlements of disputes. The burden of proof there is "clear and convincing evidence" which is somewhere beyond a preponderance of evidence but not quite at the stage of beyond a reasonable doubt.

So, in my case I have the TSBs on the car that are written by GM. GM acknowledges there is a problem with my car starting before I even purchased it. The TSBs were revised to expand the vehicles covered, so GM acknowledges the problem is widespread. Finally, I have the notes from a GM technician on the repair invoice that the problem was a warranty item and that it was not repaired the first time (as I specifically instructed them to do) when they charged me out-of-pocket.

There isn't a judge that is going to buy the argument that it was OK for GM to charge me for a repair that DID NOT FIX THE PROBLEM and that the problem immediately resurfaced, 12 miles later, and the warrantied fix did correct the problem. The judge is going to look at the TSBs written by GM and know they have a problem that is acknowledged by them. They're going to look at the insufficient repair made to my car when I specifically told them that was not the problem I was experiencing. They're going to look at the notes on the invoice from the GM technician stating that the warrantied repair was necessary to fix the issue. They're more than likely to rule in my favor.

Thanks to the rules of evidence in my state, GM cannot have the TSBs or repair invoices excluded as hearsay evidence. My state has a "business records" exemption to hearsay where a business record created in the ordinary course of business operations is presumed to be accurate and correct, and it can only be excluded if there is clear and convincing evidence that such records are false or incorrect.


----------



## 6Speed2016LT (Jun 14, 2016)

This slave cylinder issue sucks....GM always either gives us a hard time or mis-diagnoses it....Last February I had my clutch fluid bled to the max at the dealership to try and stave this off, My cruze is a Feb build 2016 I believe (Gen 2) and so far, so good for me. I think I will do a clutch bleed on a regular basis if this will stave off the issue. Looking at the picture of the slave cylinder online, I am not too sure what debris is actually breaking off and clogging it. I would love to see this debris first hand....Are we talking half an inch in size? The size of sand? Just what does this debris look like..
I think I will get my vacuum pump out again this weekend, hook it up to the nipple and change the fluid. Paranoid about this....LOL

Jason


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

6Speed2016LT said:


> Looking at the picture of the slave cylinder online, I am not too sure what debris is actually breaking off and clogging it. I would love to see this debris first hand....Are we talking half an inch in size? The size of sand? Just what does this debris look like..


It isn't clogging the slave cylinder. It's doing 3 things:
1. It's clogging an orifice in the pipe between the master and the slave cylinders.
2. The debris shed means the slave cylinder isn't working properly.
3. The debris (according to the UK and EU recalls) is causing problems with the ABS controller module to the point that it needs to be replaced in the recall.

In my case, I had symptoms of 1 and 2. My clutch pedal was sticking to the floor AND the slave cylinder wasn't working (the transmission would not go into gear).


----------



## 6Speed2016LT (Jun 14, 2016)

Do you think then Barry by doing regular clutch fluid changes this may help the problem?

Jason


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

6Speed2016LT said:


> Do you think then Barry by doing regular clutch fluid changes this may help the problem?


Absolutely not. A failing slave cylinder is a failing slave cylinder. You might prevent the problem of the clutch pedal sticking, but you will never prevent the problem of the slave cylinder failing.


----------



## 6Speed2016LT (Jun 14, 2016)

Barry Allen said:


> Absolutely not. A failing slave cylinder is a failing slave cylinder. You might prevent the problem of the clutch pedal sticking, but you will never prevent the problem of the slave cylinder failing.


Hey Barry, I agree on that for sure. However, from what I read, most of the issues people are having here is the debris clogging the orfice....Is the actual slave cylinder failing or is it simply the debris issue most people are having?

Jason


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

6Speed2016LT said:


> Is the actual slave cylinder failing or is it simply the debris issue most people are having?


The debris is FROM the slave cylinder. The recalls in the EU and UK state it's debris from the slave cylinder that contaminates the hydraulic fluid and can damage brake components, so that's why it's all replaced.


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

Won't budge on charging for the master cylinder and lines. $1100-ish. Still don't know when I'll get the car back, have been 'car free' for 10 days now. If they do the entire repair right the first time (ignoring the shared fluid reservoir, and thus anything to do with the brakes/ABS module for the time being), I suppose I should credit them vs. some of these tales of woe.

I'm not sure where to go next. Between possible brake problems, and that my pistons haven't cracked yet but very likely will (occasionally hear clanks from under the hood when I get on it), and all the trouble with crudded up intake valves and turbos and cheap plastic vacuum booster pumps... Should I exit this unreliable money pit? 21,000 miles & 4 1/2 years of ownership.


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

17Hatch6MT said:


> Won't budge on charging for the master cylinder and lines.


Why are they replacing the master cylinder? Did they diagnose it as failed?


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

I'll possibly get the car back tomorrow. I won't be able to tell you exactly what until then.


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

OK. All the symptoms you describe point to a failed slave cylinder, which isn't a reason to replace anything other than that and whatever other associated parts (maybe some hoses, and a complete fluid flush of everything). Unless they can specifically state that the master cylinder is failed, they shouldn't be shotgunning parts at the job.


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

Clutch slave was replaced under warranty. The master was replaced for just less than $1000. I asked for the parts back. The slave was not given because as a warrantied item GM will get it back. The master looks like a plastic snap-together toy. I can't tell if it's failed. The pedal side looks dry. It was making noises for a long time, but since it was just a slight sound and seemed to be working, I figured complaining about it was not going to be helpful. If I knew it was going to need replacing, I would have brought it in sooner. Again, <21000 miles, 4 1/2 years of ownership.

I don't know what I can realistically do to recover the $1000. I just made it clear to Chevrolet rep that they wouldn't see me in that or any GM showroom again.

As little as I drive, I might start looking for something used/certified, that has a rep of being more reliable. Something w/o turbos, w/o DI or at least with port inj in addition, and no widespread costly and owner-stranding issues reported.

On the other hand, perhaps I owe the dealer service org the benefit of the doubt. If they've fixed it properly the first time (sure does feel lots different on the drive home), maybe they deserve more credit than Mr. Allen's dealership which failed to fix the car the first time. Regardless, mad about the $1000 out of pocket for a nearly new car.


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

The recall in the EU and UK includes replacing the master cylinder. I guess the understanding by Opel/Vauxhall is that the fluid contamination can affect the master cylinder.

I have no idea if that is the case in the USA as GM is being notoriously stingy about this TSB and not even doing a recall. If you had the choice, you could have had just the slave cylinder replaced under the warranty and kept your master cylinder in place to wait if it started showing problems. If they can't even tell you WHY the master cylinder needed replacing with specific problems, it's suspicious that they're shotgunning parts at the car.


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

According to the "Dealer Empowerment for Goodwill, Customer Enthusiasm and Policy", the dealer could have offered a 'Policy Repair' (discount on the non-covered items) given that I bought the car there new, that I've had it serviced there only, and that the mileage is so low. If they had, according to the 2017 Bulletin table, I would have paid only $200 or 25% (not clear on greater or lesser) of the nearly $1000 that I did pay. They apparently don't value my business. I will try calling them & see if they will budge on this, but the 'GM Customer Care' agent didn't indicate any help would be forthcoming. Extremely disappointed.



https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2020/MC-10178291-9999.pdf




https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2017/MC-10113978-9999.pdf


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

.


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

@Barry Allen - In retrospect, I think you're right. The nearly $1000 I paid was not only a violation in spirit of the base warranty, and a violation in practice of the 'Policy' repair rebates that the dealership could have given, it was probably an unneccesary repair. The master cylinder was probably okay. It was all a case of a money-grubbing dealership, as I've seen on some Yelp reviews of this dealership.

The funny thing is, they may have never intended to do a warranty repair. The tech honestly pronounced the cause as a leaking slave cylinder, but the service writer initially fought me on it being a warranty repair. Had to call GM Customer Care to get it assigned as a warranty repair. And then, maybe only because it was inadvertently called out in the brief statement that I could read about the warranty. ( "... such as, slave cylinder, etc...." )

So, not likely I'll return to this dealer for service, and I'll never buy a new GM car again, and I may get rid of this one as they're known to be troublesome in many ways (pistons, etc.). I have a new word in my lexicon, 'Stealership'. And, you bet I'll tell of my experience to others, for example work associates, who may be considering a new car.


----------



## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

17Hatch6MT said:


> @Barry Allen - In retrospect, I think you're right. The nearly $1000 I paid was not only a violation in spirit of the base warranty, and a violation in practice of the 'Policy' repair rebates that the dealership could have given, it was probably an unneccesary repair. The master cylinder was probably okay. It was all a case of a money-grubbing dealership, as I've seen on some Yelp reviews of this dealership.
> 
> The funny thing is, they may have never intended to do a warranty repair. The tech honestly pronounced the cause as a leaking slave cylinder, but the service writer initially fought me on it being a warranty repair. Had to call GM Customer Care to get it assigned as a warranty repair. And then, maybe only because it was inadvertently called out in the brief statement that I could read about the warranty. ( "... such as, slave cylinder, etc...." )
> 
> So, not likely I'll return to this dealer for service, and I'll never buy a new GM car again, and I may get rid of this one as they're known to be troublesome in many ways (pistons, etc.). I have a new word in my lexicon, 'Stealership'. And, you bet I'll tell of my experience to others, for example work associates, who may be considering a new car.


I felt much the same way after my run-around with my Gen 1 (failed flywheel, then transmission and throw-out bearing too). I wanted to wash my hands of the first new car that I'd owned that had turned out to be nothing other than an unreliable piece of crap.

...and then I test drove a bunch of cars from other manufacturers, and kept coming back to the Gen 2 Cruze that I'd had as a rental for a long time...and traded in and bought from a dealer I'd never been to before. The car and dealer have since been great - I have had zero warranty issues besides a squeak and a bad battery, and the dealer has been great about addressing those with no drama when I was in for a recall.

Theoretically, this should address the weak points of the Gen 2 manual setup (besides the potential DMF issue that seems to plague the Gen 1's and Gen 2 diesels) and you should have no issues with the clutch setup from here on out. Hopefully. 

There are good dealers and bad dealers of ANY brand (I've had the most run-around with FCA and Toyota personally), and it can definitely make/break the experience for you.


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

There are still pistons (avg. failure mileage 28,000) and other weak spots. Reliability is worth a lot to me, since I don't have a spouse or 2nd car to rescue me when it craps out.

Talked with my local mechanic, asked his opinion about trading it for something else used (which I would bring to them to inspect before I bought). He thought it was a good idea; his impression of Gen 2 Cruzes is lots of trouble, particularly coolant leaks due to all the plastic stuff. I asked him if he was sure it was the Gen 2 cars, because it's a known issue with Gen 1. He said, yes, Gen 2 also (but maybe he's not that familiar with them...?).

Only intertia is keeping me from trading this thing now. Rode in a friend's new Corolla hybrid. Doesn't have the wind noise like an open window in my left ear, doesn't have the aggressive headrest that makes me crane my neck forward. And I wouldn't have to put premium fuel in it. I wouldn't get a hybrid, as the low miles I drive wouldn't pay back.


----------



## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

I have yet to see any cooling system issues with a single Gen 2 on the forums. GM learned their lesson there at least.

Corollas are an appliance - boring, noisy, and will go from point A to B for years without ever doing anything exciting.

If you want something less blah to drive, the upcoming Civic looks way less like it was designed by a 12 year old, and the Hyundai Elantra N line may be the enthusiast pick of what’s left of the segment. They may be the only manuals left in the segment besides the Jetta GLI (which is also good, but probably not reliable).

I really liked the Crosstrek but the base engine was underpowered at the time. They seem to have rectified that now by shoving the 2.5 from the Forester into it.


----------



## 6Speed2016LT (Jun 14, 2016)

jblackburn said:


> I have yet to see any cooling system issues with a single Gen 2 on the forums. GM learned their lesson there at least.
> 
> Corollas are an appliance - boring, noisy, and will go from point A to B for years without ever doing anything exciting.
> 
> ...


I think what's worth noting here is that "what goes in, eventually comes out" By learning about all the issues here and doing whatever I can to mitigate them, at least for me, has turned in to a super reliable car. Yes I just had a small oil leak fixed on the lower oil pan, but ANY car can leak there eventually.

Broken piston rings.....mitigated by good oil and high octane gas

Slave Cylinder failure......potentially mitigated by clutch bleeding and refilling on a somewhat frequent basis to clean out any debris.

Poor Economy.......mitigated by using top tier gas and or injector cleaners/spark plug changes.

I am coming up on 5 years of ownership and have no serious issues where people who have 2018's are having a ton of issues.

I truly believe that good preventative maintenance is worth it's weight in gold..

Granted, a car should not have these issues when so new, but sometimes you have to adapt to them or just sell it and move on if you can.

Cheers,

Jason


----------



## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

6Speed2016LT said:


> I think what's worth noting here is that "what goes in, eventually comes out" By learning about all the issues here and doing whatever I can to mitigate them, at least for me, has turned in to a super reliable car. Yes I just had a small oil leak fixed on the lower oil pan, but ANY car can leak there eventually.
> 
> Broken piston rings.....mitigated by good oil and high octane gas
> 
> ...


Yep. Preventative maintenance does go a long way, but there are definitely manufacturer defects with every single car on the market - some quite worse than others. 

My 2016 has been great to me as well, but my 2012 was a nightmare of a "new" car and hopefully has been less dramatic to whoever bought the thing once tons of the original production defects were fixed.


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

6Speed2016LT said:


> Slave Cylinder failure......potentially mitigated by clutch bleeding and refilling on a somewhat frequent basis to clean out any debris.


The slave cylinders fail because the seals shed debris. Sure, bleeding the clutch annually (why not quarterly if you are paranoid enough?) might prevent that debris from breaking other things, like the brake master cylinder or some other brake parts as are affected in the recall in Europe. But it's going to to nothing to prevent the slave cylinder itself from failing.


----------



## 6Speed2016LT (Jun 14, 2016)

Barry Allen said:


> The slave cylinders fail because the seals shed debris. Sure, bleeding the clutch annually (why not quarterly if you are paranoid enough?) might prevent that debris from breaking other things, like the brake master cylinder or some other brake parts as are affected in the recall in Europe. But it's going to to nothing to prevent the slave cylinder itself from failing.


From your best guess, at what point do they actually fail. After time, after certain mileage etc etc? I had a service advisor friend of mine run several high mileage canadian cars many months ago looking at service done ....123,000 to 186,000 kms all were manuals to see the service history and not one had any slave cylinder work, Obviously this would not show any work outside of the GM service system, so it truly begs the question as to how widespread this actually is.
Colder canadian climate not as hard on the seals? who knows, but I have asked probably three large GM dealers in my area if they have ever performed this repair and all have said no. Also, the manual cruzes lived on until the very end up here in Canada as they were much more popular here then in the US. I think 2018 was the last year for a manual in the US. Up here you could still get them in 2019.
I just wish I knew what was the "breaking point" so to speak as to when the failure
occurs.........time....mileage, heat soak etc....

Also, would be interesting to see how many of the US made vs Mexican made Cruzes had this issue.....you never know!

Jason


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

6Speed2016LT said:


> From your best guess, at what point do they actually fail.


Only God knows. It could be entirely random.

The MT Cruze was sold from model years 2016-2018 (2019 was an abbreviated model year with 100% automatic transmissions) and 100% of them are covered by the GM TSB. GM seems to acknowledge that 100% of them can have problems and they obviously repair it if it's within the warranty, but they're playing the long game of hoping they all make it past warranty to where they can ignore customer complaints of a $2,000 repair.

In the EU and UK, this is a safety recall regardless of age or mileage. The manufacturers there (Opel/Vauxhall) appear to acknowledge this is a large safety issue because it can affect braking if the brake master cylinder is compromised as has apparently happened in enough cars to be noticeable. It's a full, complete recall, PERIOD. All of the cars are to be fixed at no cost to owners.

As for your question of Mexican assembly: all of the manual transmissions come from Austria. The powertrain plant there assembles the M32 transmissions for vehicles all over the globe, of different manufacturers. It's a powertrain sharing with GM and Fiat, and the transmissions go into lots of cars. It doesn't matter if your Cruze hatchback was assembled in Mexico because the transmission came from Austria and was made with the defective slave cylinders for the model years in question. It doesn't matter if your Cruze sedan was made in American because the transmission came from Austria and was made with the defective slave cylinders for the model years in question.


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

I've now noticed the brake pedal sinks slowly. On first use after it's been parked for a while. Maybe takes a bit more effort to get the brake to grab. Seems normal after that first 100 feet -- doesn't noticeably sink, doesn't take more effort. Fluid level is ok so far, haven't noticed it going down yet. Will this get worse, what do I have to look forward to? Haven't found a good description of what exactly triggered the European recall.


----------



## 6Speed2016LT (Jun 14, 2016)

17Hatch6MT said:


> I've now noticed the brake pedal sinks slowly. On first use after it's been parked for a while. Maybe takes a bit more effort to get the brake to grab. Seems normal after that first 100 feet -- doesn't noticeably sink, doesn't take more effort. Fluid level is ok so far, haven't noticed it going down yet. Will this get worse, what do I have to look forward to? Haven't found a good description of what exactly triggered the European recall.


Any air in the brake lines anywhere? I know that can give you a very spongy feel. I am going to get in the habit of bleeding my brakes once a year as well. Always satisfying to see that dirty fluid being replaced......


----------



## 17Hatch6MT (Dec 28, 2015)

6Speed2016LT said:


> Any air in the brake lines anywhere? I know that can give you a very spongy feel. I am going to get in the habit of bleeding my brakes once a year as well. Always satisfying to see that dirty fluid being replaced......


Hope that's all it is. Wouldn't bet on it. Drove it last night, no issue at all that time.


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

17Hatch6MT said:


> Haven't found a good description of what exactly triggered the European recall.


I'd like that question answered myself.

In the USA, it was obviously a bunch of clutch pedals sticking to the floor. GM created the first TSB (PIP5558) on Feb 28, 2018. At that point they probably had a number of 2016 and 2017 vehicles showing this problem, and it was enough to say "Hey, what is going on here?" The TSB states: *"Currently engineering is investigating the condition and trying to isolate the root cause of the debris. Please replace item number 1 (Elbow) and item number 2 (Line). Please tape a plastic bag over each end of the line to retain as much fluid as possible to be returned with the part." *At that point they were investigating the issue because they knew there was a problem.

PIP5558A (dated Mar 6, 2018, so 7 days after the initial TSB) says the same thing but the updated bulletin removed build date categories and added regions of affected vehicles.

PIP5558B (dated Jun 6, 2018) doesn't have anything new other than stating: *"Engineering is currently investigating and a bulletin will be published when a repair is validated." *

PIP5558C (dated Jul 23, 2018) states: *"The source of the debris is the dampener in the high pressure line."*

Meanwhile, across the Atlantic Ocean, Opel and Vauxhall had their own safety recall in the EU and UK where the stated cause of the issue is debris from the slave cylinder seals that contaminates the clutch and brake fluid. The recall was based on the debris causing the seals on the brake master cylinder to fail, meaning that slow/slight applications of the brake pedal do nothing but panic/hard stops still work. The safety recall involves replacing the slave cylinder, pipework, brake master cylinder, and the ABS controller module. The replacement of these parts points to an issue where they must expect that the debris in the fluid will cause issues with the ABS controller module in the future, because it's a mandatory 100% replaced item under a safety recall (no mileage exclusions for owners, no limits on second owners, etc.).

It's weird how two different car companies that used to be the same company (GM sold Opel in 2017) come up with different causes of the same problem.


----------



## Barry Allen (Apr 18, 2018)

17Hatch6MT said:


> Haven't found a good description of what exactly triggered the European recall.


On Mar 9, 2018 someone was posting in a Vauxhall message forum that there was a similar TSB that was an almost immediate response to complaints. Read in the image I've attached below.

So, it appears that the first TSB or recall for Vauxhall was the clutch pipework same as the TSB for GM in the USA (though the GM TSB is not a recall), and then at some point later it became a safety recall.


----------

