# Negative camber on real wheels



## 70AARCUDA (Nov 14, 2010)

...I recall seeing alignment specs for the european Cruze on another website, but it's down at the moment; when it returns, I'll try to get the link to you.

...beyond that, suggest you ask your local tire shop and Chevy dealership.


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## Spaceme (Jan 20, 2011)

If I recall, the maximum negative camber angle on the Cruze is -2 degrees. And unfortunately, the rear camber on the Cruze is NOT adjustable. And there is not way to add a camber kit to it because of the way the rear struts attach to the rear suspension.


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## 72buickgs (Mar 20, 2011)

take a look at the corvettes, from the 60's and up, they all run negative camber on the rear. 
i owned a '75 datsun 710 ht than ran, would u believe, several degrees of positve camber in the front.


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## cruze 2011 (Oct 20, 2010)

my car has over 8000 miles just had the tires rotated and noticed there was no uneven wear yet . if you rotate like gm recomends i dont think you will have any problems with the rear tires


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

Negitive camber = better cornering traction. Camber doesn't cause tire wear, toe does...


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## itsbmw (Feb 5, 2011)

Skilz10179 said:


> Negitive camber = better cornering traction. Camber doesn't cause tire wear, toe does...


Would that explain the better handling I have on this car compared to my GP?


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## Burtess (Apr 7, 2011)

Skilz10179 said:


> Negitive camber = better cornering traction. Camber doesn't cause tire wear, toe does...


I understand the reason for negative camber, but the Michelin site says this:

*Camber*

Camber is the angle of the wheel, in degrees, when viewed from the front of the vehicle. Positive camber is when the top of the wheel is leaning out from the center of the car. Negative camber is when the top of the wheel is leaning into the car. If the wheel leans too far from the center, uneven wear will occur. The camber angle is designed and adjusted per vehicle to keep the tires on the outside of a curve flat on the ground during a turn. If you have too much positive camber, your tires will wear on the outside. _*Too much negative camber will wear them on the inside.*_ If there is too much of a difference between the camber settings on the front wheels, the vehicle will tend to pull sharply to one side. 

Now I do not know how much is "too much".... but it makes sense that if more weight is pressing on the inside of the tread, that it will wear faster. I can see that the rear tires contact more on the inside when driving over wet road, the outside half-block of tread is dry....

Burt


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

A tire will always show the most wear where it has the most contact with the ground. With that said, negitive (within reason) camber doesn't cause tire wear any more than zero degrees of camber does. Most real sports cars with 4 wheel independent suspension run 1-2 degrees of negitive camber all around stock, and when suspension is compressed (resulting from body roll from hard cornering) can yield up to 5 degrees negitive camber.

If you ever get uneven tire wear such as the inside or outside of the tire wears faster, its most likey caused by toe.


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## 70AARCUDA (Nov 14, 2010)

...Volkswagens, Corvairs, etc. lived OK with negative camber (except for Ralph Naders' opinion).


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## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

Skilz10179 said:


> Negitive camber = better cornering traction. Camber doesn't cause tire wear, toe does...


You have Camber mixed up with Caster.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

JDM-USDM Love said:


> You have Camber mixed up with Caster.


Actually I'm quite certain i know what camber and caster are and how they effect a cars performance, no mix up here!


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## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

Skilz10179 said:


> Actually I'm quite certain i know what camber and caster are and how they effect a cars performance, no mix up here!


You also said camber is not a wear angle when it is.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

I said "A tire will always show the most wear where it has the most contact with the ground. With that said, negitive (within reason) camber doesn't cause tire wear any more than zero degrees of camber does.". Meaning that camber does not pull or push a tire across the road surface causing wear like toe does and 1-2 degrees shouldn't cause a tire to wear any faster than 0 degrees would.


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## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

^ even under frequent rotations, once the wear pattern on the inboard side has begun it will continue even when on the front where camber may be 0. My Civic is about -1.5 in the rear and it still wears more on the inboard tread thus lowering the life of the tire. Just because the camber is not "pushing" the car doesn't mean it's not causing an irregular wear pattern. I've done a dozen or so alignments on OEM cars and about the same on track cars. Again Caster is the only non tire wearing angle of measurement. - Camber is also over rated IMO.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

I run -6 in the front and -5 degrees of camber on my 240 and there still isn't a real noticeable difference in tire wear between the inside and outside of the tire tread.


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## 70AARCUDA (Nov 14, 2010)

...just so the rest of us "know" what the two of you are cussing & dis-cusing:


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## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

Skilz10179 said:


> I run -6 in the front and -5 degrees of camber on my 240 and there still isn't a real noticeable difference in tire wear between the inside and outside of the tire tread.


Tracking it often will do that. However for your every day grocery getter it wont be leaning hard on either side of the vehicle. Not enough to keep tire wear even that's for sure. We are going to have to agree to disagree at this point.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

JDM-USDM Love said:


> Tracking it often will do that. However for your every day grocery getter it wont be leaning hard on either side of the vehicle. Not enough to keep tire wear even that's for sure. We are going to have to agree to disagree at this point.


My Civic Si also runs roughly -1.4 (+/-.2) degrees of camber, been running the same sets of summer and winter tires for years without any signs of uneven wear. I'm not trying to argue anymore, but if your car has uneven tire wear and only running a small amount of negative camber you may want to take it to a reputable alignment shop and have the toe checked.


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## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

Toe doesn't cause that type of wear. You would have issues with feathering instead


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## turbocruiser (Sep 10, 2011)

I've been driving/collecting Corvairs for years. Yes you're correct about negative camber. We have been setting them up with extra negative angles, for driving on road race couses. It most definately inhances cornering. My Cruze caught my eye with the negative camber, which is why I'm on this page. I'm glad it is a factory setting, and not a bent axle. The car does handle quite well, especially considering it's an ECO with a stick, and doesn't have the Z-link set up.


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## Jake1295 (Nov 28, 2011)

i've seen guys with -2 wear out tires faster than guys with -5 or more (normal driving) when you adjust camber yourself it usually messes up the toe. when the toe isn't right then your tires aren't moving straight down the road so you get a lot of wear
of course any camber will cause uneven wear but not necessarily abnormal amounts


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

Jake1295 said:


> i've seen guys with -2 wear out tires faster than guys with -5 or more (normal driving) when you adjust camber yourself it usually messes up the toe. when the toe isn't right then your tires aren't moving straight down the road so you get a lot of wear
> of course any camber will cause uneven wear but not necessarily abnormal amounts


Very true.


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