# How much 'Myth-Busting' will the Chevy Cruze Diesel need?



## 70AARCUDA (Nov 14, 2010)

...the secondary story article: GM Priming Pump for Diesel-Powered Cruze | Sales & Marketing content from WardsAuto


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## Eugene_C (Mar 15, 2012)

70AARCUDA said:


> ...the secondary story article: GM Priming Pump for Diesel-Powered Cruze | Sales & Marketing content from WardsAuto



Yep, that sums up the quandary pretty well.


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## ErikBEggs (Aug 20, 2011)

Aside from the poor image of diesels, a problem with this car will most likely be the performance. The diesels overseas with the 2.0 TDI aren't very fast, and people already bitch about how slow the Cruze is.


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## Eugene_C (Mar 15, 2012)

ErikBEggs said:


> Aside from the poor image of diesels, a problem with this car will most likely be the performance. The diesels overseas with the 2.0 TDI aren't very fast, and people already bitch about how slow the Cruze is.


IIIRC, diesels are often competitive with gas in the 0-40 mph range, which is where a lot of Americans do their suburban acceleration.


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## Dale_K (Jul 16, 2011)

Gonna be a tough sell when diesel is so expensive compared to regular gas.


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## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

Dale_K said:


> Gonna be a tough sell when diesel is so expensive compared to regular gas.


That's part of the education. Diesel is a tad over premium in most areas, but when you're getting hybrid class fuel economy, people start paying attention.


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## Eugene_C (Mar 15, 2012)

Dale_K said:


> Gonna be a tough sell when diesel is so expensive compared to regular gas.


Actually, since regular has spiked recently, the gap is closing. 

Keep in mind that a gallon of diesel weighs almost a pound more than a gallon of gasoline and has more BTUs of energy. It is more expensive because it takes 16% more oil to make.


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## 70AARCUDA (Nov 14, 2010)

Diesel contains about 10% _more_ BTU's of energy than gasoline, so as long as the co$t of diesel fuel is _within_ 10% of gasolines' co$t, diesel is more co$t-effective. But, that doesn't include diesel engines' "additional" co$ts of "urea" additives and more frequent oil/filter changes.


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## Eugene_C (Mar 15, 2012)

70AARCUDA said:


> Diesel contains about 10% _more_ BTU's of energy than gasoline, so as long as the co$t of diesel fuel is _within_ 10% of gasolines' co$t, diesel is more co$t-effective. But, that doesn't include diesel engines' "additional" co$ts of "urea" additives and more frequent oil/filter changes.


But don't diesel engines also extract more energy out of the oil because of the high compression?


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## 70AARCUDA (Nov 14, 2010)

...in the past, the traditional answer was a solid, "yes," but with today's gasoline engines moving toward direct-injection and turbochargers, the compression-ratio "increase" gap is _diminishing_ quickly...for example, Mazda's new "SkyActive" engine's *13.0:1* ratio!


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## Dale_K (Jul 16, 2011)

I had a 2007 Dodge pickup with the (then new) 6.7 Cummins. Eventually I had service records for 16 unscheduled visits to the service department - 14 check engine lights and 2 recalls. The turbo had been replaced once, cleaned once after the first replacement and it had another check engine light for the same problem. To Chrysler's credit, they bought it back from me when I complained but it soured me on diesels.

And I understand the BTU value of the fuel but you'll need to get at least 20% better fuel economy to even come close to making it work financially. I still plan on taking a test drive in a Cruze diesel when they come out but mainly to feel how the power difference feels.


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## Eugene_C (Mar 15, 2012)

Dale_K said:


> ....And I understand the BTU value of the fuel but you'll need to get at least 20% better fuel economy to even come close to making it work financially. I still plan on taking a test drive in a Cruze diesel when they come out but mainly to feel how the power difference feels.


I just got back from a gas station today, and these were the prices:

Regular: $3.99, Mid: $4.14, Prem: $4.24, Diesel: $4.09.

The differential has dropped to 2.5%. !!


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## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

Dale_K said:


> I had a 2007 Dodge pickup with the (then new) 6.7 Cummins. Eventually I had service records for 16 unscheduled visits to the service department - 14 check engine lights and 2 recalls. The turbo had been replaced once, cleaned once after the first replacement and it had another check engine light for the same problem. To Chrysler's credit, they bought it back from me when I complained but it soured me on diesels.
> 
> And I understand the BTU value of the fuel but you'll need to get at least 20% better fuel economy to even come close to making it work financially. I still plan on taking a test drive in a Cruze diesel when they come out but mainly to feel how the power difference feels.


Keep in mind, there is zero purpose for driving a Diesel truck if you don't need to do any heavy towing. All you'll be doing is spending extra money on maintenance and parts. 



Eugene_C said:


> I just got back from a gas station today, and these were the prices:
> 
> Regular: $3.99, Mid: $4.14, Prem: $4.24, Diesel: $4.09.
> 
> The differential has dropped to 2.5%. !!


That's a pretty insignificant difference. If it does get better fuel economy, its a no-brainer.


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## Eugene_C (Mar 15, 2012)

Diesel prices are back to being higher than gas now. Gas is around $3.59 and diesel is around $3.89.

I'm searching the news services regularly but have not found any updates on the release date, yet.


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## Beachernaut (Mar 27, 2012)

Making the diesel version cost effective isn't just the price difference between the fuel. Last time I shopped for trucks (quite a few years ago) the diesel engine was a $6k option, add that to the price difference for maintenance and you were looking at a huge number of miles before you started seeing any savings.

I'm curious what the diesel option will cost on the Cruze. Buying a $2k option on a $40k car is one thing. That same $2k option on a $20k car is quite another.

IMO they're going to have to meet or beat the VW TDI. The Jetta TDI starts at $22k, if GM can match that I think they'll do ok. If not, they're just shooting themselves in the foot.


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## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

Beachernaut said:


> Making the diesel version cost effective isn't just the price difference between the fuel. Last time I shopped for trucks (quite a few years ago) the diesel engine was a $6k option, add that to the price difference for maintenance and you were looking at a huge number of miles before you started seeing any savings.


For people like me and you, yeah, but if you need to tow heavy equipment on your job site every day or a very large boat out to the lake, $6,000 is a drop in the bucket. You're buying a tool to do a job, which is really what diesel trucks are designed for.


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## Beachernaut (Mar 27, 2012)

XtremeRevolution said:


> For people like me and you, yeah, but if you need to tow heavy equipment on your job site every day or a very large boat out to the lake, $6,000 is a drop in the bucket. You're buying a tool to do a job, which is really what diesel trucks are designed for.



I completely agree. I was just using that as an example. I think pricing for the Cruze diesel is going to have a huge impact on its success. The example of the truck will only be magnified since hauling a heavy load (where the diesel really shines over gas) doesn't come into play.


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## boynton6spd (Apr 17, 2012)

diesel fuel should cost LESS than gas as it is less refined...
up untill the wars in iraq and afganistan it was cheaper, the military uses so much over seas, it has raised demand...


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## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

Beachernaut said:


> I completely agree. I was just using that as an example. I think pricing for the Cruze diesel is going to have a huge impact on its success. The example of the truck will only be magnified since hauling a heavy load (where the diesel really shines over gas) doesn't come into play.


Unless they offered a Cruze Diesel with a big towing package. Now that would be something...


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## Patman (May 7, 2011)

Is it? Alot of people tune their engines and that reaquires Hi octane which cost about the same as diesel also. For the avg joe that uses regular it might be some teeth gritting. Something to "mull" over as well as the improved MPG. 



Dale_K said:


> Gonna be a tough sell when diesel is so expensive compared to regular gas.


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## Beachernaut (Mar 27, 2012)

boynton6spd said:


> diesel fuel should cost LESS than gas as it is less refined...
> up untill the wars in iraq and afganistan it was cheaper, the military uses so much over seas, it has raised demand...


Yes, it needs less refining, but also there's less fuel created per gallon of oil than gas. Add that to other factors (supply/demand, cost of additives, efficiency hits from smog equipment, etc) and it becomes very cloudy as which fuel is actually cheaper to produce and run. Then add in taxes, restrictions, etc and it goes from very cloudy to down right mind bending. I would love to read some actual factual information that's not bias or misleading, but I wouldn't even know where to start.



XtremeRevolution said:


> Unless they offered a Cruze Diesel with a big towing package. Now that would be something...


hehehehe..... I would hope that the towing package includes gearing, braking, and suspension upgrades.


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