# Pioneer upgrade sucks



## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

Replacing the amp will not improve anything. You need to replace the speakers as well. This is not an issue related to a lack of power.


----------



## queencitypr0 (Feb 16, 2011)

Here is the pioneer diagram


----------



## David1 (Sep 16, 2011)

I have to agree, I just picked up a 13 cruze with the Pioneer stereo and it sucks. I could do something better from the JC Whitney catalog! Standard set up is better. No amount of fiddling with settings works, Hardly any volume even when turned all the way up and the only sound from the back is muddled base even with base turned down to -7!!!!


----------



## jdubb11 (Mar 14, 2012)

David1 said:


> I have to agree, I just picked up a 13 cruze with the Pioneer stereo and it sucks. I could do something better from the JC Whitney catalog! Standard set up is better. No amount of fiddling with settings works, Hardly any volume even when turned all the way up and the only sound from the back is muddled base even with base turned down to -7!!!!


how is the standard raido better? ive had both and the standard radio is terrible. the pioneer isnt great but ill take it over the standard radio anyday. little sound from rear doors with both radios


----------



## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

jdubb11 said:


> how is the standard raido better? ive had both and the standard radio is terrible. the pioneer isnt great but ill take it over the standard radio anyday. little sound from rear doors with both radios


It would appear that those who don't like the "boomy" sound that the rear 6x9 subwoofers produce would rather have the base system. It seems that it's not very easy to adjust that bass volume.


----------



## David1 (Sep 16, 2011)

I like base, but not low quality muddy base with a lousy front sound staging. This system sounds very monoish to me if that makes sense. I also just tried a good CD for the first time and the system was much better. I would say the sound quality from XM is the worst with FM sound in the middle. I have tone adjusted for all the modes to. My other cars have Hardon Karmon with suround sound and those systems rock. 

I wonder if getting some better tweeters and better 6x9's with dual voice coils would help.


----------



## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

David1 said:


> I like base, but not low quality muddy base with a lousy front sound staging. This system sounds very monoish to me if that makes sense. I also just tried a good CD for the first time and the system was much better. I would say the sound quality from XM is the worst with FM sound in the middle. I have tone adjusted for all the modes to. My other cars have Hardon Karmon with suround sound and those systems rock.
> 
> I wonder if getting some better tweeters and better 6x9's with dual voice coils would help.


Number of voice coils have zero effect on sound quality. They are usually used to offer additional impedance options for amplification purposes. 

XM and FM will sound terrible. CD and Aux will sound better, with USB being best. That's just the way it works, as the bandwidth for XM and FM are quite low. I can barely tolerate Pandora through my phone compared to USB. 

The tweeters both play completely off-axis, so the top end will fall off and you'll have less of that "sparkle." Besides that, the tweeters aren't very good from the factory. Then again, keep in mind who you're talking to, lol. I design home theater speakers on the side, so I pick up on everything that's missing. 

If you want to improve sound, the first two steps would be to add a front component set and some door treatment. A subwoofer would also be recommended. It is my firm belief that if you want better-than-stock sound, you are much, much better off upgrading with aftermarket components than you are paying extra for the Pioneer system. For that extra $500-$700 that people pay for that upgrade, you can get sound quality that will blow your mind.


----------



## David1 (Sep 16, 2011)

Its basically a free option with the allstar package. I guess I was expecting to much from it. GM could have at lease put a little more effort into it.


----------



## brian v (Dec 25, 2011)

David1 said:


> Its basically a free option with the allstar package. I guess I was expecting to much from it. GM could have at lease put a little more effort into it.


GM tries to give us quality . it is the quality of the made in china products introduced into our assembly plants . pioneer once was a quality company . now not so much .


----------



## brian v (Dec 25, 2011)

I agree with x.experience with these issues is not for the novice ! doing a bit of research and asking pertanant questions will help you install a decent sound system. trial and error can also get you along too.


----------



## gm mech (Feb 2, 2013)

i found the same with my system but some fine tuning and a pioneer 10" dvc sub from a cobalt and aftermarket amp tied into the remote wire of the stock amp made a huge difference :th_coolio:


----------



## brian v (Dec 25, 2011)

So we do not have to go over board with the cost of an install of a new system to reach a desired sound quality !
a decent component upgrade is all that I required for the moment.


----------



## chuck5330 (Oct 1, 2011)

It boggles the mind to think after SEVERAL years of complaining that the PIONEER SETUP SUCKS! that GM still can't figure this stuff out. My god, doesn't anyone up there actually SIT in one of these cars?


----------



## brian v (Dec 25, 2011)

No!


----------



## spaycace (Feb 9, 2012)

David1 said:


> Its basically a free option with the allstar package. I guess I was expecting to much from it. GM could have at lease put a little more effort into it.


First off ... NOTHING is free! It's just offered at a discounted price when you put multiple options into one package somehow. 
Seconly, try out this link. PCRU11 | KICKER I was looking into them, but have the pioneer "upgrade" which is a FAR cry better than the base stereo system, but it's not comparable to aftermarket by any means.


----------



## spaycace (Feb 9, 2012)

chuck5330 said:


> It boggles the mind to think after SEVERAL years of complaining that the PIONEER SETUP SUCKS! that GM still can't figure this stuff out. My god, doesn't anyone up there actually SIT in one of these cars?


I don't know why they didn't just stick with Bose in ALL their vehicles? I had an 03 Yukon with the Bose system, and it kicked some pretty good @$$! Now, the 2012 Avalanche that replaced the 2003 Yukon actually HAS a Bose system w/centerpoint surround sound, but to my ears, the 03 system still sounded better.


----------



## Silver LT RS (Jun 4, 2012)

That looks like a valuable wiring diagram said:


> View attachment 10426
> 
> 
> Here is the pioneer diagram


That looks like a valuable wiring diagram, would you also have the previous page that went with this? Thanks


----------



## queencitypr0 (Feb 16, 2011)

Silver LT RS said:


> That looks like a valuable wiring diagram, would you also have the previous page that went with this? Thanks


Sure.


----------



## bryanakron40 (Nov 8, 2012)

It is still a Cruze guys. It isn't a Cadillac or an Acura. It is an upgrade from the base unit. If you took it to mean it was going to sound like being in the front row of a concert, the test drive didn't last long enough. **** just upgrading the speakers makes a difference in most cases. I do agree the rears do seem muffled a little but I think that has a lot to do with placement in these cars. I could be wrong.


----------



## spacedout (Dec 7, 2010)

The pioneer "upgrade" sucks in the new malibu too, designed after the cruze. Sounds exactly the same(muddy overpowering rear bass).


----------



## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

spacedout said:


> The pioneer "upgrade" sucks in the new malibu too, designed after the cruze. Sounds exactly the same(muddy overpowering rear bass).


Maybe it's the layout or the space inside the car, but for some reason, it didn't bother me as much in the Malibu as it did in the Cruze. Then again, I wasn't able to compare them side to side.


----------



## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

bryanakron40 said:


> It is still a Cruze guys. It isn't a Cadillac or an Acura. It is an upgrade from the base unit. If you took it to mean it was going to sound like being in the front row of a concert, the test drive didn't last long enough. **** just upgrading the speakers makes a difference in most cases. I do agree the rears do seem muffled a little but I think that has a lot to do with placement in these cars. I could be wrong.


Meh. Other members of my family have a Ford Escape and Jeep Liberty with a kickass sound system. They're not expensive cars. 

This cars stock sound is on par with a Honda from the 90s. It's just terrible. 

The stock head unit isn't too bad, but the speakers definitely make a huge difference. 


Sent from AutoGuide.com App


----------



## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

jblackburn said:


> Meh. Other members of my family have a Ford Escape and Jeep Liberty with a kickass sound system. They're not expensive cars.
> 
> This cars stock sound is on par with a Honda from the 90s. It's just terrible.
> 
> ...


I've heard and replaced failed speakers in a Jeep liberty and was unimpressed due to the total lack of clarity. I wouldn't say they're any better, IMO.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using AutoGuide App


----------



## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

XtremeRevolution said:


> I've heard and replaced failed speakers in a Jeep liberty and was unimpressed due to the total lack of clarity. I wouldn't say they're any better, IMO.
> 
> Sent from my SGH-T999 using AutoGuide App


Musta not been the Infinity.


----------



## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

jblackburn said:


> Musta not been the Infinity.


Oh, it was Infinity alright. I know this because I had an inconvenient surprise when I pulled the old failed speaker and discovered that the amplifier was mounted to it. The dealer wanted $250 to replace that speaker, which had blown for no good reason at around 60k. I ended up unscrewing the amplifier from the speaker and bolting it to the door. The biggest issue I had with that factory system (when it didn't sound like it was cracking and popping) was a total lack of midrange clarity. It sounded like it was being played through a pillow. Should have seen the look on her face when she heard the replacements I had put in there for $60.


----------



## David1 (Sep 16, 2011)

I wonder what Pioneer would say if they heard these systems. I bet they would quit paying the advertising fees to GM.


----------



## 20131pz69 (Oct 22, 2012)

David1 said:


> I have to agree, I just picked up a 13 cruze with the Pioneer stereo and it sucks. I could do something better from the JC Whitney catalog! Standard set up is better. No amount of fiddling with settings works, Hardly any volume even when turned all the way up and the only sound from the back is muddled base even with base turned down to -7!!!!


something's seriously wrong with this review. I have a 2013 w/ the pioneer system & though it's no mind- numbingly great, it's certainly better than the base system- enough to justify the $500 upgrade. What are you playing? Is it a high bitrate track?


----------



## 20131pz69 (Oct 22, 2012)

also wanted to make a note. When I play music via Bluetooth, the quality's much better than via AUX (not 100% sure about USB).


----------



## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

20131pz69 said:


> also wanted to make a note. When I play music via Bluetooth, the quality's much better than via AUX (not 100% sure about USB).


This may be the reason many are not satisfied. FM and XM are terrible for sound quality. AUX, CD, and Bluetooth streaming (if you've modified the car to accept it) provide far better sound quality.


----------



## The_Madcat (Oct 6, 2012)

I would have to disagree. The system doesn't suck, I find it to be exactly what I paid for. It's not going to be concert quality and nowhere does it state it will be. For a stock system, it is pretty well off considering the price of it. It will definitely "suck" if you expect it to be audiophile quality. If you want that, don't be dumb and order the system that clearly isn't what you are looking for.


----------



## Chase Toole (Feb 4, 2013)

*Hmm.. I bought a 2012 LT RS with the Pioneer and it is awesome... Go listen to the stereo in a Corrola, Focus, Civic, Lancer, or anything else in this class and the Cruze is crushing it... If you want a loud system aftermarket is the only option... Go get a pair of 12s and about a 1000w amp, should do the trick lol*


----------



## ifiltez (Jan 5, 2013)

What does Bitrate mean ?

If you guys are playing through a cd, I would check the bit rate of the audio files that you burned on them.
Me and my brother have put systems in our older vehicles. It usto bother me that with the same vehicle, our two tracks would sound completely different.

It doesn't seem like much, but if you listen to music through quality headphones you can hear big differences on all levels.
The same applies with speakers, if they're higher quality speakers and you play lesser bit rate tracks, you will be able to hear more "muddy bass" than you would with lower quality speakers...

Sorry if this post is a weird format, this is my first time ever being on a forum.


----------



## rodneyiii (Oct 23, 2012)

Queencitypr0 - Would you be able to capture the wiring diagrams from your website as PDF's? The scanned JPG's are quite readable. Thanks.


----------



## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

ifiltez said:


> What does Bitrate mean ?
> 
> If you guys are playing through a cd, I would check the bit rate of the audio files that you burned on them.
> Me and my brother have put systems in our older vehicles. It usto bother me that with the same vehicle, our two tracks would sound completely different.
> ...


Unfortunately, there is more to this than just bitrate, although I would agree it does make a big difference. The stock system has a significant dip in frequency response in the vocal range, a weak midbass, an overly shouty speaker, and and a weak top end above 8khz. It's not a very good design, but it is cheap.


----------



## ifiltez (Jan 5, 2013)

XtremeRevolution said:


> Unfortunately, there is more to this than just bitrate, although I would agree it does make a big difference. The stock system has a significant dip in frequency response in the vocal range, a weak midbass, an overly shouty speaker, and and a weak top end above 8khz. It's not a very good design, but it is cheap.


I've only had one other car and I changed out the speakers rite away. I was thinking about trading mine in for the all-star edition, but so far I'm liking the speakers in my LT. Thank you so much for the info!


----------



## XtremeRevolution (Jan 19, 2012)

ifiltez said:


> I've only had one other car and I changed out the speakers rite away. I was thinking about trading mine in for the all-star edition, but so far I'm liking the speakers in my LT. Thank you so much for the info!


The Pioneer system that you'll find in the all-star edition is not worth the extra price. Get the all-star package if you want the sunroof, but that's it. You'd be much better off adding a subwoofer and new speakers yourself than you would with the Pioneer system.


----------



## OnlyTaurus (Mar 20, 2012)

I think the Pioneer system is great. Raised an eyebrow after hearing it from the factory, but once I spent time tweaking the EQ and fade, I think it sounds perfect.


----------



## spacedout (Dec 7, 2010)

OnlyTaurus said:


> I think the Pioneer system is great. Raised an eyebrow after hearing it from the factory, but once I spent time tweaking the EQ and fade, I think it sounds perfect.


I think the same thing about the standard factory stereo, if one adjusts the settings a bit it sounds much better than most other cars in the class. At $445 extra($1345 on the 1LT with the all star package, otherwise its not an available option) for nothing more than amped low frequency 6X9's the money is better spent adding a real sub. 

At that price one could just buy the Plug & play powered 10inch kicker makes for $699. For $1200 you could buy the complete kicker setup which includes the sub & also adds a DSP/amp for the other inside speakers. Obviously these prices are higher than one could build a custom setup but being plug & play with a very clean install look, seems like a decent price to pay.


----------



## Tjax (Sep 14, 2012)

20131pz69 said:


> also wanted to make a note. When I play music via Bluetooth, the quality's much better than via AUX (not 100% sure about USB).


Bluetooth>Aux? That's not what I've found at all. The Aux is louder and much clearer sounding IMO. Although...... I'm thinking of "Aux" being my iPod connector. Are you referring to the headphone jack cable?

Sent from my Nexus 7 using AutoGuide.Com Free App


----------



## Tjax (Sep 14, 2012)

Also I was gonna say that I've grown to like my pioneer somewhat so far. Its not on par with my old aftermarket systems I had but it sounds like my system "burned in" and started sounding better over time. Unfortunately I had a Cadillac SRX work vehicle for the week last week and its Bose system ruined my Cruze ears lol. Now back driving my Cruze it sounds like poop. 

Sent from my Nexus 7 using AutoGuide.Com Free App


----------



## Darkhoust (Jan 24, 2011)

Just bought a 13 2LT with the pioneer upgrade. The stock bass system in my 11 LT was better than this. The bass is too overpowered for the speakers, and it also sounds very muddy. The bass does not tie well into the treble and mid AT ALL. This "system" is utter garbage. Time to go aftermarket


----------



## cecaa850 (Apr 9, 2012)

Old thread alert.

A simple way to improve the audio in these is to disconnect the center dash speaker. Imaging and separation both improve.


----------

