# ZZP Parts Released...



## tehcor (Mar 30, 2011)

Niicccce.I am def gonna look at that downpipe.wonder how the intake compares to injen?


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

Hmm, interesting...


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## Spaceme (Jan 20, 2011)

From ZZP's site up until a couple of days ago (Google Cache):

Cobalt & Ion ---> ZZ Performance

"Stainless downpipe- should sell for about $160(offroad) to $240 (catted) and take about a half hour to install. (+4hp)
Aluminum Intake tube- should sell for about $160 and it will take about a 15 minutes to install. It made 12hp on the stock computer because it leaned out the AFR and bumped the boost, but going from a tuned computer to the tuned computer with this tube it will give you about 5-6hp."

So the final prices of these parts is WAY higher than what was originally posted as to what they would cost. $279.99 for the non-catted pipe and $269.00 for the intake. This is much higher that what was posted they should cost. So what the heck?

I was interested in these parts before, but with such high prices, I am leaning to NOT buying.


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## tehcor (Mar 30, 2011)

I def agree with you on the intake part.injen is cai or short ram capable for only 20$ more.downpipe might be promising tho


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## Spaceme (Jan 20, 2011)

*Way too expensive*

Last night the ZZP website listed the intake for $269.99 and the non-catted pipe for $279.99 (which in ZZP's tech artcle from their website listed an estimated release price of $160 for both). This morning ZZP is showing both for $300 each! I was interested but not now. So WTF ZZP?

By the way, they have edited the original tech article removing any mention of what the release price should have been but it can still be found with a Google search of cached websites.


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

Looks like the intake is $299 now


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## rlhammon (Apr 7, 2011)

I've talked to the ZZP guys a lot, and live close by to them. I'm trying to lean on my friendship with them to see what happened with pricing. If I learn anything I'll post back.

That's a chunk of change to drop for those parts... wish it wasn't so much.


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## TGrayEco (Feb 25, 2011)

My first truck I bought an AEM brute force CAI for it. It cost me around $260...so the price for the Injen intake and others really isn't that bad. Nothing is ever cheap anymore anways, plus you get what you pay for.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

Sadly the prices are probably about supply and demand, they are the only ones with parts so they can charge high prices. I've been in contact with them lately, i'll let them know the forum's reaction to their pricing change...


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## ECOsleeper (Apr 3, 2011)

I have quite a few ZZP parts on my Regal. Not surprised at all at the price jump. Glad they are working on parts for the Cruze though.


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## Cruze2011LTZ (Apr 20, 2011)

Skilz10179 said:


> Sadly the prices are probably about supply and demand, they are the only ones with parts so they can charge high prices. I've been in contact with them lately, i'll let them know the forum's reaction to their pricing change...


You have the Injen intake coming already though. Their downpipe is just fine at that price, I will prob get one, but Injen for the intake for me (Better quality, from a name brand air intake manufacture.)


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## tehcor (Mar 30, 2011)

Cruze2011LTZ said:


> You have the Injen intake coming already though. Their downpipe is just fine at that price, I will prob get one, but Injen for the intake for me (Better quality, from a name brand air intake manufacture.)


exactly. supply and demand doesnt give them the right to keep raising the prices.I was looking at making some purchases but forget it now..


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## Spaceme (Jan 20, 2011)

Well, I was about to bite the bullet and order the ZZP Midpipe but it seems as of this morning both pages for the ZZP Midpipe and the ZZP Intake are now gone from the ZZP website. Hopefully they are reconsidering their prices (to go lower, not higher). I am about to e-mail them to see what's going on. I will post if I get a response.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

I did email them a couple days ago letting them know how people on here were reacting to their price changes, i have yet to hear back from them.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

Got an email reply from ZZP after letting them know how people were reacting to the prices, here's a part of it....

"
Thanks for the heads up. Unfortunately, the person who posted projected prices doesn't have much involvement with fabrication, so his price estimates were not very accurate. After we complete a new product, we break down our cost and determine a selling price. In this case, I was involved in the intake pricing and our cost was quite a bit higher than $160, so we obviously can't sell them for that price. As far as the statements in the thread where people have mentioned that it would be better to purchase Injen at that price, I can assure you that ZZP builds much higher quality parts than Injen. We have battled their intakes in other platforms. When I say "battled" I mean they make it difficult to tune vehicles. It does not appear that they do any type of development or testing to make sure that MAF scaling is correct before they release an intake. They simply mass-produce something that looks shiny and fits in the car. We are not that type of vendor. When we develop a new part, such as this Cruze intake, we spend a lot of time developing the product to make sure it performs. In the case of the Cruze, this is very important because the ECM uses the MAF sensor to reference target airflow and adjusts the boost pressure accordingly. We have performed dozens of dyno pulls on our intakes to get the MAF scaling exactly the way we want it. I feel that this is very important."

Take that for what you will. No one likes high prices but if they are competitive with with other companies like Modern Performance who are working on developing the same parts then you really can't blame ZZP. Either way i gotta give ZZP props for coming up with these parts, and i can't wait to see whats next!


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## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

I like ZZP but how can they claim Injen does no research with it's MAF and tunability when their own intake leans out the car. Also to that, how lean does it get? Considering the Cruze runs 87 this has the potential to be a real issue.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

JDM-USDM Love said:


> I like ZZP but how can they claim Injen does no research with it's MAF and tunability when their own intake leans out the car. Also to that, how lean does it get? Considering the Cruze runs 87 this has the potential to be a real issue.


The Injen causes a very rich air/fuel ratio, their own dyno chart shows a 10.48:1. That doesn't look like they put too much effort into it.

One of my good friends had a Injen intake on his Sti, while being dyno tuned the tuner actually made him take it off due to it causing inconsistant MAF sensor readings at different throttle positions.

As for the ZZP causing a lean a/f, i'm also curious to know how lean. I would love to see a dyno chart with a a/f plot as well.


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## tehcor (Mar 30, 2011)

Skilz10179 said:


> The Injen causes a very rich air/fuel ratio, their own dyno chart shows a 10.48:1. That doesn't look like they put too much effort into it.
> 
> One of my good friends had a Injen intake on his Sti, while being dyno tuned the tuner actually made him take it off due to it causing inconsistant MAF sensor readings at different throttle positions.
> 
> As for the ZZP causing a lean a/f, i'm also curious to know how lean. I would love to see a dyno chart with a a/f plot as well.


exactly...talk is cheap.if they wanna bash on injen and how its causing it to run lean...show one of the many dyno charts that theyve done that shows the difference.


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

FYI, price on the intake is now $259 ($247 CAN  ). (Cobalt & Ion ---> ZZ Performance )


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## tehcor (Mar 30, 2011)

VictoryRed08 said:


> FYI, price on the intake is now $259 ($247 CAN  ). (Cobalt & Ion ---> ZZ Performance )


i saw that too...guess they smartened up alittle bit. think I might give em a try along with the downpipe so i can get my full exhaust welded up. hopefully they are as good as they talk.


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## slecyk (Mar 12, 2011)

it is a SRI isn't it?


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

slecyk said:


> it is a SRI isn't it?


Yes it is a short ram intake.


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## slecyk (Mar 12, 2011)

What kind of gains do you guys think would be expected from switching out the mid pipe and would you pass emissions with the non-cat version?


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## WHITECO (Mar 31, 2011)

slecyk said:


> What kind of gains do you guys think would be expected from switching out the mid pipe and would you pass emissions with the non-cat version?


No you won't pass emissions...not sure about power increase though


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

slecyk said:


> What kind of gains do you guys think would be expected from switching out the mid pipe and would you pass emissions with the non-cat version?


4hp

Source:
Cobalt & Ion ---> ZZ Performance


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

WHITECO said:


> No you won't pass emissions...


I'm not so sure about that... Just adding the catless mid pipe you will still retain the stock cat in the downpipe (just down stream from the turbo). 

Does the stock mid pipe even have a second cat? The cat option on the ZZP mid pipe may just be due to the fact their downpipe is strictly going to be catless.


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## Blue Angel (Feb 18, 2011)

Usually the cat located close to the engine is there specifically to reduce cold start emissions while the "main" downstream cat (once warm) significantly reduces emissions. I'm not familiar with the Cruze exhaust system or the ZZP parts, but if removing the downstream (main) cat is what's being discussed then I will guess to say you will NOT pass an emissions test since this is the cat that's responsible for the majority of emissions reduction.

I have removed the close-coupled (cold start) cat on one of my vehicles to put a header on and left the downstream (main) cat in place and the car passes emissions beautifully. Cold start is not a measured requirement for on going testing, only from the factory to pass regulations.


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## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

It's still technically illegal to remove the cat from a road driven vehicle. That being said... I'm glad I live in Ohio.....


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

I did a little looking around about our exhaust system. For those that don't know, on a turbocharged motor you want to modifiy the exhaust (post turbo) to flow as freely as possible to yield gains over the entire powerband. Our exhaust is in 3 sections separated by flanges bolted together. 

1. The downpipe or O2 housing as ZZP has labeled it. This section connects directly to the turbo's turbine housing starting with a few inches of pipe where a O2 sensor is mounted followed immediately by the first cat, then a couple more inches of piping before the flange. ZZP claims their largest gains from replacing this section with their catless replacement.

2. The mid pipe. This section starts with a small resonator, then a longest section of straight piping in the entire exhaust and then into the 2nd cat. There may be a 2nd O2 sensor in this section as well but it was hard to see from the angle i was at. ZZP claims their 2nd biggest gains from using their catless replacement for this section.

3. The cat-back section. This section starts with a long large muffler followed by 3 90 degree bends before entering the main muffler with the inlet and outlet on the same side (180 bend inside) and finally out the tailpipe. ZZP has told me they are planning to sell a cat-back exhaust system but claims very minimal gains from it compared to the downpipe and mid pipe. Their cat-back will mainly be for people who are interested in letting a little more sound out of the 1.4.

Keeping my car quiet while improving efficiency is the goal for my car so I have personally been considering going with the catless downpipe and mid pipe along with the oem cat back section...


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## slecyk (Mar 12, 2011)

Good info Skilz. Going along with what you said, if we go catless on the downpipe and midpipe and leave the catback exhaust stock would we pass emissions?


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

Skilz10179 said:


> I did a little looking around about our exhaust system. For those that don't know, on a turbocharged motor you want to modifiy the exhaust (post turbo) to flow as freely as possible to yield gains over the entire powerband. Our exhaust is in 3 sections separated by flanges bolted together.
> 
> 1. The downpipe or O2 housing as ZZP has labeled it. This section connects directly to the turbo's turbine housing starting with a few inches of pipe where a O2 sensor is mounted followed immediately by the first cat, then a couple more inches of piping before the flange. ZZP claims their largest gains from replacing this section with their catless replacement.
> 
> ...


Hmmm, interesting, thanks for the info. I was pondering about that the other day, running the downpipe and/or midpipe instead of the cat-back.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

slecyk said:


> Good info Skilz. Going along with what you said, if we go catless on the downpipe and midpipe and leave the catback exhaust stock would we pass emissions?


 Definitely not if they do an exhaust gas analysis...


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## slecyk (Mar 12, 2011)

ZZP short ram arrived today and I got it installed. Took it for a little joy ride to test it out. It is definitely quite a bit louder and throttle response is much better. You can really feel the boost now too in the higher RPM's. The blow off sound is much more apparent as well. Pretty cool  Can't wait to get it tuned now.


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

slecyk said:


> ZZP short ram arrived today and I got it installed. Took it for a little joy ride to test it out. It is definitely quite a bit louder and throttle response is much better. You can really feel the boost now too in the higher RPM's. The blow off sound is much more apparent as well. Pretty cool  Can't wait to get it tuned now.


Congrats, let us know if you notice any difference in MPG or if the car has any issues running it without a heatshield.

Also, just out of curiousity, did it come with instructions (not that they're really needed).


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## LARRY01Z28 (Dec 4, 2010)

take soem video if you can. so we can hear how loud it is. thanks.


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## slecyk (Mar 12, 2011)

VictoryRed08 said:


> Congrats, let us know if you notice any difference in MPG or if the car has any issues running it without a heatshield.
> 
> Also, just out of curiousity, did it come with instructions (not that they're really needed).



No instructions, but like you said it is pretty easy. The blow off sound is enough to make me happy with the purchase but there is without a doubt a noticeable increase in throttle response and power. It is gonna be hard to get any accurate MPG readings with the way I've been driving it haha.


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## Blue Angel (Feb 18, 2011)

Skilz10179 said:


> 1. The downpipe or O2 housing as ZZP has labeled it. This section connects directly to the turbo's turbine housing starting with a few inches of pipe where a O2 sensor is mounted followed immediately by the first cat, then a couple more inches of piping before the flange. ZZP claims their largest gains from replacing this section with their catless replacement.
> 
> 2. The mid pipe. This section starts with a small resonator, then a longest section of straight piping in the entire exhaust and then into the 2nd cat. There may be a 2nd O2 sensor in this section as well but it was hard to see from the angle i was at. ZZP claims their 2nd biggest gains from using their catless replacement for this section.


As far as I know, OBDII requires a second O2 sensor behind the catalytic converter(s). This sensor does nothing to contribute information to the ECM about A/F ratios, its sole purpose is to make sure the cat(s) are in place and working correctly.

The first O2 sensor is located before any catalytic converter and feeds the ECM with A/F ratio information during closed-loop operation.

I replaced the OEM manifolds and cats on my '02 Z06 with long tube headers and 3" Random Tech cats (included in the LG Pro LT Header kit). The car will (just) pass an emissions test with the aftermarket cats, but my SES light is on permanently as the exhaust loses so much heat through the header primaries that the cats take too long to "light off" and the ECM picks up on that (the OBDII code reads something to the effect of "Bank 1 Slow To Respond").



Skilz10179 said:


> 3. The cat-back section... ...Their cat-back will mainly be for people who are interested in letting a little more sound out of the 1.4.
> 
> Keeping my car quiet while improving efficiency is the goal for my car so I have personally been considering going with the catless downpipe and mid pipe along with the oem cat back section...


Since the exhaust loses heat as it travels from the engine to the tailpipe, the "volume" of exhaust gasses is also reduced (according to the Ideal Gas Law). This makes the flow requirement of the exhaust system far more critical close to the engine and less critical farther downstream.

Many OEM cars have a cat with a slightly larger inlet than outlet for this reason - the piping pre-cat is larger to handle the higher volume (hotter) exhaust flow.

Your proposed approach makes a lot of sense; you will remove restriction where it matters most while still retaining the sound deadening benefits of the OEM muffler out back. Judging by your signature you may or may not have made the "mistake" of replacing the OEM exhaust system on a four cylinder with a "glasspack" absorbtion style muffler on a car you drove a lot... I made that mistake (Saturn) and I will never make it again! 

My Z exhaust system starts with 1.75" primaries ~34" long, 3" merge collectors, 3" R/T cats, 3" X-pipe, dumping into the OEM 2.5" piping and mufflers. LG designed the entire system 3" and then necked it down to 2.5" to fit the OEM (and most aftermarket) muffler systems. IMO, the 5-6 hp I'm losing to the OEM mufflers isn't worth the tradeoff in additional noise by going with an aftermarket muffer, especially when the car already makes over 400 hp.

The consensus in the Corvette community is roughly the same as ZZP's statement you made above; change the upstream stuff for power, change the muffler for sound. My Z sounds much better at WOT then it did before due to the headers, but the OEM mufflers ensure quiet drone-free cruising. Opening up the piping post-turbo on the Cruze may not change the sound much (maybe if there is a resonator as you suggested), but it will increase flow where it is needed most without turning it into an annoyingly loud car you don't want to drive.


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## tehcor (Mar 30, 2011)

Blue Angel said:


> As far as I know, OBDII requires a second O2 sensor behind the catalytic converter(s). This sensor does nothing to contribute information to the ECM about A/F ratios, its sole purpose is to make sure the cat(s) are in place and working correctly.
> 
> The first O2 sensor is located before any catalytic converter and feeds the ECM with A/F ratio information during closed-loop operation.
> 
> ...


you write novels everytime you post lol.and have you seen the size of the muffler on the cruze?looks like it belongs on a diesel. trading that out for a borla or magna flow will reduce weight and make it sound better.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

Blue Angel said:


> Since the exhaust loses heat as it travels from the engine to the tailpipe, the "volume" of exhaust gasses is also reduced (according to the Ideal Gas Law). This makes the flow requirement of the exhaust system far more critical close to the engine and less critical farther downstream.


My thoughts exactly!



Blue Angel said:


> Your proposed approach makes a lot of sense; you will remove restriction where it matters most while still retaining the sound deadening benefits of the OEM muffler out back. Judging by your signature you may or may not have made the "mistake" of replacing the OEM exhaust system on a four cylinder with a "glasspack" absorbtion style muffler on a car you drove a lot... I made that mistake (Saturn) and I will never make it again!


I haven't owned a quiet car in years so i've thinking a lot about the best way to better exhaust flow and still be pretty quiet, i've getting too old to have a loud daily driver lol.

While i'll agree most glasspack (fart can) mufflered exhaust systems do a horrible job keeping a car quiet but some work quite well. My 240 (n/a 2.4) has a huge 85mm (almost 3 3/8") HKS exhaust that uses a absorbtion style muffler, a small resonator, no cat and its almost too quiet. Unfortunatly most exhaust companies (even the big ones) don't play around much with resonator placement and mufflers enough to suppress sound. They just build something that fits and call it a day...



Blue Angel said:


> The consensus in the Corvette community is roughly the same as ZZP's statement you made above; change the upstream stuff for power, change the muffler for sound. My Z sounds much better at WOT then it did before due to the headers, but the OEM mufflers ensure quiet drone-free cruising. Opening up the piping post-turbo on the Cruze may not change the sound much (maybe if there is a resonator as you suggested), but it will increase flow where it is needed most without turning it into an annoyingly loud car you don't want to drive.


Judging by the size of the mufflers in the cat back section and the fact the cat is turbocharged (also acts as a muffler) i think it shouldn't be too loud but i won't know for sure until i try...

On a friends Marauder we installed Kooks long tube headers that replaced the stock manifolds and the 4 cats, the stock cat back exhaust with oem mufflers did almost nothing to suppress sound. I was amazed how loud it was! Then he had a shop build him a custom mandrel 2.5" X pipe duel cat back system using the biggest 2.5" inlet/outlet mufflers Magnaflow (straight through design) makes and amazingly it was quiet as stock again. Sometimes stock mufflers don't do ****...


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## iKermit (Dec 13, 2010)

Wow Skillz really informative posts! I should then really delay the whole Exhaust thing for after i get a turbo (whenever warranty ends)..


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## tehcor (Mar 30, 2011)

iKermit said:


> Wow Skillz really informative posts! I should then really delay the whole Exhaust thing for after i get a turbo (whenever warranty ends)..


 why? you can always go to any exhaust shop and have the exhaust cut and flange welded on to mate with the downpipe whenever you go turbod.


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## iKermit (Dec 13, 2010)

tehcor said:


> why? you can always go to any exhaust shop and have the exhaust cut and flange welded on to mate with the downpipe whenever you go turbod.


Freaking ****, your right :|. Sorry i am on some serious medication.


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## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

tehcor said:


> why? you can always go to any exhaust shop and have the exhaust cut and flange welded on to mate with the downpipe whenever you go turbod.


And possibly get some high school drop out doing shitty MIG welds that look like Michael J Fox was holding the torch.


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

JDM-USDM Love said:


> And possibly get some high school drop out doing shitty MIG welds that look like Michael J Fox was holding the torch.


I lawled a little there.


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

And the intake is back up to $299... pick a price already!


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## tehcor (Mar 30, 2011)

JDM-USDM Love said:


> And possibly get some high school drop out doing shitty MIG welds that look like Michael J Fox was holding the torch.


WTF I've done quite a few exhausts from exhaust shops are they are top notch.I guess if you wanna pay for a overpriced exhaust then that's all you bro.do you even have a cruze?why you on here talking crap?


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

tehcor said:


> WTF I've done quite a few exhausts from exhaust shops are they are top notch.I guess if you wanna pay for a overpriced exhaust then that's all you bro.do you even have a cruze?why you on here talking crap?


Unfortunately there are a number of exhaust shops out there whose workmanship is less than reputable.

Does it really even matter if he owns a Cruze or not? I didn't see anywhere in the registration form that required a VIN. I once joined a Jeep Forum specializing in making replica Jurassic Park vehicles. Did I own one, no. Was it awesome, yes.


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## slecyk (Mar 12, 2011)

VictoryRed08 said:


> And the intake is back up to $299... pick a price already!


Haha wow, glad I didn't hesitate too much.


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## 70AARCUDA (Nov 14, 2010)

...just for clarification, it's *CruzeTalk.com* not *CruzeOWNERS.com*, so _owning_ a Cruze is not necessarey for admission here.


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## slecyk (Mar 12, 2011)

70AARCUDA said:


> ...just for clarification, it's *CruzeTalk.com* not *CruzeOWNERS.com*, so _owning_ a Cruze is not necessarey for admission here.


Wait...I thought it was CRU*Z*Etalk.com 

*---you're 100% correct, 'typo' on my part, thanks for catching it! corrections made --*


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

slecyk said:


> Haha wow, glad I didn't hesitate too much.


Lol, kinda regretting that I did. Just waiting to get some money in until I buy it (maybe I can talk them down the 40 bucks).

Just out of further curiosity, did everything fit alright when you installed it?


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## slecyk (Mar 12, 2011)

VictoryRed08 said:


> Lol, kinda regretting that I did. Just waiting to get some money in until I buy it (maybe I can talk them down the 40 bucks).
> 
> Just out of further curiosity, did everything fit alright when you installed it?


oh yes, seals are nice and tight but there are obviously hose clamps just to clamp it down snug. Mounting arm lines up perfectly with one of the bolts in the engine compartment to stabilize it.


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

slecyk said:


> oh yes, seals are nice and tight but there are obviously hose clamps just to clamp it down snug. Mounting arm lines up perfectly with one of the bolts in the engine compartment to stabilize it.


ooo so there is a mounting arm! I was looking at ZZP's picture and wondering how it was secured. That makes me feel better lol.


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## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

tehcor said:


> WTF I've done quite a few exhausts from exhaust shops are they are top notch.I guess if you wanna pay for a overpriced exhaust then that's all you bro.do you even have a cruze?why you on here talking crap?



Hey if you like weld splatter that's on you bro. All I'm saying is most of the time "exhaust shops" are sub par. I'm not talking crap. I gave my opinion on the service I've seen first hand. Obviously my sig intends to show that I'm waiting for a performance trim variant of the Cruze considering my last 2 new car purchases have been similar trims.


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## tehcor (Mar 30, 2011)

I understand it CRUZETALK.com as I joined before I had a cruze...but i didn't run around running my mouth in every post.they aren't making a "performance variant" get over it. And maybe there's some bad exhaust shops...don't go to them.not hard to walk in and watch em do a customers car and see their work.


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## Spaceme (Jan 20, 2011)

VictoryRed08 said:


> And the intake is back up to $299... pick a price already!


And the the mid pipe is also back up to $299 (from $269).

WTF is up with ZZP!


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

Ok, so I emailed ZZP, $299 is indeed the price, not the 259. I didn't get an explanation as to why the price swap occured.


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## northvibe (May 4, 2011)

VictoryRed08 said:


> Ok, so I emailed ZZP, $299 is indeed the price, not the 259. I didn't get an explanation as to why the price swap occured.


they probably had some material cost changes, forgot about some labor needed, or are pricing it to make money. $300 still isnt unheard of.


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

Just ordered my ZZP intake yesterday. I think I will do a before and after vid for comparison sake.

Now to wait the 6-10 days for it to arrive.


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## Kaimumma (Apr 14, 2011)

Dang you guys tweak in these forums sometimes sheesh. I miss one day of logging in and all of a sudden there's a new testament to any kind of mods to the 1.4. 

Anyways, why do I get this feeling that ZZP doesn't sound the most promising? I understand it's a competing market to sell what you make, but to hit on a company like Injen by saying it's just a shiny tube in your engine bay?


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## slecyk (Mar 12, 2011)

Kaimumma said:


> Dang you guys tweak in these forums sometimes sheesh. I miss one day of logging in and all of a sudden there's a new testament to any kind of mods to the 1.4.
> 
> Anyways, why do I get this feeling that ZZP doesn't sound the most promising? I understand it's a competing market to sell what you make, but to hit on a company like Injen by saying it's just a shiny tube in your engine bay?


Not sure what the reasoning for it was but I think it stems mainly from the question of "If the ZZP is as much as the Injen then why should I buy ZZP?" This type of question when asked to a company is a roundabout way of saying "You make an inferior product to what Injen makes." That can get annoying I am sure. I like ZZP, they are a smaller company which means quality control is top notch. The intake is very well built and exactly what I was looking for. All in all, I'm happy I went with ZZP.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

Kaimumma said:


> Dang you guys tweak in these forums sometimes sheesh. I miss one day of logging in and all of a sudden there's a new testament to any kind of mods to the 1.4.
> 
> Anyways, why do I get this feeling that ZZP doesn't sound the most promising? I understand it's a competing market to sell what you make, but to hit on a company like Injen by saying it's just a shiny tube in your engine bay?


ZZP did not announce that for the world to read, that was an email to me which i shared. I have personally seen a professional tuner struggle with tuning my friend's Sti due to the Injen intake causing the MAF to read funny.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

hi....


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## 5.0 Junkie (Mar 25, 2011)

I can't remember. Has ZZP posted any dyno graphs with a/f ratio? The one I saw for the Injen went WAY fat at higher rpm. Not what I want to be doing. It is already pretty rich from the factory.


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## TRIFECTA (Feb 17, 2011)

I got my ZZP intake today and I love it. It doesn't sound "weird" like my "hacked airbox" mod did. It also seems to keep the fueling very close, if not spot on, I didn't notice any surging or weirdness driving with it. I need to get my datalogger on it and double check everything but I'm quite sure it's going to be close.

But so far, I'm super impressed with it.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

VinceTrifecta said:


> I got my ZZP intake today and I love it. It doesn't sound "weird" like my "hacked airbox" mod did. It also seems to keep the fueling very close, if not spot on, I didn't notice any surging or weirdness driving with it. I need to get my datalogger on it and double check everything but I'm quite sure it's going to be close.
> 
> But so far, I'm super impressed with it.


I put mine on today too, i'm also diggin it! Keep us posted, i'm eager to see how a wide band reads compared to stock.


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## slecyk (Mar 12, 2011)

VinceTrifecta said:


> I got my ZZP intake today and I love it. It doesn't sound "weird" like my "hacked airbox" mod did. It also seems to keep the fueling very close, if not spot on, I didn't notice any surging or weirdness driving with it. I need to get my datalogger on it and double check everything but I'm quite sure it's going to be close.
> 
> But so far, I'm super impressed with it.


**** yea Vince, I've got the ZZP intake as well and just placed my order for the trifecta tune today! Should be a pretty killer combo


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## ECOsleeper (Apr 3, 2011)

Anyone have a video of the ZZP intake... similar to the video injen one yet? Just for comparison.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

ECOsleeper said:


> Anyone have a video of the ZZP intake... similar to the video injen one yet? Just for comparison.


No video but one thing i can confirm with the ZZP intake that i didn't hear in the injen video is hearing the compressor spool. I was really surprised you could hear the turbo so well, i knew the BOV would be noticable but i was kind of shocked to hear so much of the compressor.


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

ECOsleeper said:


> Anyone have a video of the ZZP intake... similar to the video injen one yet? Just for comparison.


I'll make one when I get mine in a week or so.

Wow Skillz, I like that wrinkle black. Kind wish I got it instead of the Black Gloss. O well.


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## Kaimumma (Apr 14, 2011)

*ZZP, Trifecta combo*



VinceTrifecta said:


> I got my ZZP intake today and I love it. It doesn't sound "weird" like my "hacked airbox" mod did. It also seems to keep the fueling very close, if not spot on, I didn't notice any surging or weirdness driving with it. I need to get my datalogger on it and double check everything but I'm quite sure it's going to be close.
> 
> But so far, I'm super impressed with it.


Vince please do let us know how you come about eventually with the ZZP and tune combo. 

Just to confirm, the ZZP intake is a Short Ram Intake setup just like Skillz pic yes? So this means since Vince has the ZZP now, and if there are any tweaks he can make out of it, it will soley be for a SRI setup, not a CAI? 

Hmmm.......if Vince gets the ZZP to work with his tune, I'm feeling a tear drop in my heart.  I already ordered the Injen intake setup....we'll see.


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## TurboTechRacing (Nov 3, 2010)

Kaimumma said:


> Vince please do let us know how you come about eventually with the ZZP and tune combo.
> 
> Just to confirm, the ZZP intake is a Short Ram Intake setup just like Skillz pic yes? So this means since Vince has the ZZP now, and if there are any tweaks he can make out of it, it will soley be for a SRI setup, not a CAI?
> 
> Hmmm.......if Vince gets the ZZP to work with his tune, I'm feeling a tear drop in my heart.  I already ordered the Injen intake setup....we'll see.


 
Vince *WILL* tune for the Injen intake also. Dont worry  Just takes 1 member to have it, and he will tune for it!


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

Kaimumma said:


> Vince please do let us know how you come about eventually with the ZZP and tune combo.
> 
> Just to confirm, the ZZP intake is a Short Ram Intake setup just like Skillz pic yes? So this means since Vince has the ZZP now, and if there are any tweaks he can make out of it, it will soley be for a SRI setup, not a CAI?
> 
> Hmmm.......if Vince gets the ZZP to work with his tune, I'm feeling a tear drop in my heart.  I already ordered the Injen intake setup....we'll see.


Just to answer your question, the ZZP intake is a short ram intake, just like what Skills has.

Vince will tune any modifications you have on you vehicle, he's talented like that.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

VictoryRed08 said:


> I'll make one when I get mine in a week or so.
> 
> Wow Skillz, I like that wrinkle black. Kind wish I got it instead of the Black Gloss. O well.


Well maybe you'll get lucky, i ordered a gloss black and recieved a wrinkle black instead lol!


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

Skilz10179 said:


> Well maybe you'll get lucky, i ordered a gloss black and recieved a wrinkle black instead lol!


Lol nice! I asked ZZP to send me a pic and then to describe what it looks like. It didnt look quite like yours and they described it as "rough satin", so I ended up going with the gloss.

I can't wait for mine to arrive, hate driving a car w/o an intake. Now I just need wait to see what kind of charges I get hit with at the border...


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## Kaimumma (Apr 14, 2011)

TurboTechRacing said:


> Vince *WILL* tune for the Injen intake also. Dont worry  Just takes 1 member to have it, and he will tune for it!





VictoryRed08 said:


> Just to answer your question, the ZZP intake is a short ram intake, just like what Skills has.
> 
> Vince will tune any modifications you have on you vehicle, he's talented like that.


Thanks for the confirmation guys!


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

Just got and installed my ZZP intake today. I was really impressed with how solid the intake is. Everything fit together without any problems.

Sounds great, little bit louder than I thought it would be. I will get a vid up soon, and have any mpg stats in soon.


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## twin1987 (Mar 28, 2011)

sweet keep us posted!!


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## ZZSteve (May 13, 2011)

hey guys  i finally JUST signed up here LOL......i see there were some concerns with pricing on the new products....we changed up the design slightly from the original, so the speculated price kinda went out the window....it cost more to build them than we were originally hoping to sell them for  


glad to see you guys with our intake like them so far! it really lets you hear that turbo for sure! you should hear ours with the o2 housing, downpipe and intake on it...i cant believe how loud the turbo is....im going to try and get a video up very soon.


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## TGrayEco (Feb 25, 2011)

Gah, I can't decide if I want to spend the money....but it'd be cool to be able to hear the turbo.


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## rlhammon (Apr 7, 2011)

ZZSteve said:


> hey guys  i finally JUST signed up here LOL......i see there were some concerns with pricing on the new products....we changed up the design slightly from the original, so the speculated price kinda went out the window....it cost more to build them than we were originally hoping to sell them for
> 
> 
> glad to see you guys with our intake like them so far! it really lets you hear that turbo for sure! you should hear ours with the o2 housing, downpipe and intake on it...i cant believe how loud the turbo is....im going to try and get a video up very soon.


I'll have to stop by sometime (I'm about 30 mins away from your shop)... I've been talking to Tim via e-mail for sometime concerning my LNF Solstice.

Would be nice to see the car / parts and decide what I want to do.


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## ZZSteve (May 13, 2011)

that would be great! just ask for me when you get here and ill take you around and show you goodies


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## Bama_Eco (May 5, 2011)

Skilz, any improvement on mpg? 

I care more about efficiency than performance, but I'll take a bump up in performance if it comes with efficiency. I told myself I wasn't going to mod my Cruze, but I can never leave well enough alone. I already got one money pit, so I don't need another. 

Also, what size is the intake piping? 3 inch?


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

Bama_Eco said:


> Skilz, any improvement on mpg?
> 
> I care more about efficiency than performance, but I'll take a bump up in performance if it comes with efficiency. I told myself I wasn't going to mod my Cruze, but I can never leave well enough alone. I already got one money pit, so I don't need another.
> 
> Also, what size is the intake piping? 3 inch?


Yup, it's 3" piping I do believe.


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## Grim (Apr 12, 2011)

3 inch on the zzp and how much on the injen? Just want to compare..i want the sound mostly so im kinda bummed that it seems the zzp intake is louder from what im reading here.


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## Bama_Eco (May 5, 2011)

How exactly is the intake mounted? Can't really see from the pictures.

Edit: Dang, I forgot about the MAF. I was looking to make my own intake, but looks like I might get the ZZP.


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

Bama_Eco said:


> How exactly is the intake mounted? Can't really see from the pictures.
> 
> Edit: Dang, I forgot about the MAF. I was looking to make my own intake, but looks like I might get the ZZP.


On the back of the intake tube there is a solid mounting arm welded to it. You then bolt the intake tube to the engine mount I believe.

I was on the fence about how it sounds, at lower RPMs you can hear the intake sucking in air, but the whoosh of air after you let your foot off the gas is downright addictive. It makes acceleration more "throaty" too.


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## Skilz10179 (Mar 22, 2011)

MPG is hard to judge because i'm finding it hard to keep my foot out of it and always wanting to hear the turbo sounds lol, with that said for the 300 miles i've had the intake on MG has not went down.

The pipe O.D. looks to be about 3", there is a sleve inserted into the intake pipe just before the MAF sensor reducing the I.D. about a half inch, without it the MAF sensor will not read properly.

The mounting bracket mounts using an existing bolt on the upper motor mount.


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

I just made a quick vid revving with the ZZP intake, can't really hear the bypass valve though.


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## 2011lt1 (Dec 13, 2010)

How did I miss this thread??? I will be ordering mine soon lol


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

2011lt1 said:


> How did I miss this thread??? I will be ordering mine soon lol


Temporary blindness?? lol


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## shawn672 (Oct 31, 2010)

I prefer their intake over Injen BUT it's way more money??


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

shawn672 said:


> I prefer their intake over Injen BUT it's way more money??


Worth the extra $70 IMO (mind you I'm biased). Very solid.

FYI for all you Canadian fellows, I paid ~ $30 for shipping (USPS Priority mail) and only paid $17 when it arrived (I expected to pay a lot more at customs). It arrived in 6 days.


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## Ruger (May 21, 2011)

Alright so i read it makes 12hp on a stock cruze. You guys that have the intake that should definitely be enough to feel am i right? Also do you think it would hurt to run a dry filter on there? I don't like oiled filters.


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## shawn672 (Oct 31, 2010)

You won't really feel 12hp but you will feel the throttle response difference


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## Eco (May 13, 2011)

I hear that bypass clear as day.


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## 2011lt1 (Dec 13, 2010)

I didn't subscribe the thread after the first 2 pages. 

The fact that even Vince said it doesn't screw with the maf so far sold me. Plus its closer to the turbo so Im sure its louder and has better throttle response. Honestly Im looking for the turbo sound effect and a little more throttle response. I figure with the tune it should howl?? The tune made it louder with the stock airbox.


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

Ruger said:


> Alright so i read it makes 12hp on a stock cruze. You guys that have the intake that should definitely be enough to feel am i right? Also do you think it would hurt to run a dry filter on there? I don't like oiled filters.


From what I undestand, it isn't the best idea to change the filter on an intake as all of the testing was done on one type filter. You may run the risk of the car running differently or getting a CEL. 

You can definitely feel more throttle response. IMHO between the better sound of the intake and the better throttle response I can definitely say that my car is more fun to drive. 

I don't have any numbers on fuel economy yet, I've been driving it fairly hard and it doesn't seem any worse.


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## tim18t (May 15, 2011)

I'm probably going to just build my own for 60-70 dollars.


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## limited360 (May 6, 2011)

tim18t said:


> I'm probably going to just build my own for 60-70 dollars.


Make sure you get the bends right as not to induce turbulence over the MAF else you will be sadly dissapointed...


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## tim18t (May 15, 2011)

limited360 said:


> Make sure you get the bends right as not to induce turbulence over the MAF else you will be sadly dissapointed...



I have a bridge I'd like to sell you. 

There is one bend. Its the MAF housing size that matters most.


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

Eco said:


> I hear that bypass clear as day.


You're right you can, was listening to it on crappy laptop speakers, sounds much better on my desktop.


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## limited360 (May 6, 2011)

tim18t said:


> I have a bridge I'd like to sell you.
> 
> There is one bend. Its the MAF housing size that matters most.


Really? Does the bend affect the air density and velocity? Does the air flow faster or slower on the inside of the bend? does the air become more turbulent on the inside or outside of the bend?

Seems like that one bend just got complicated... 

I understand MAF isn't anything new, however the accuracy and response time of the ECU reading the MAF has significantly increased in the past few years. 

Simply saying I would make sure I get all of that right.


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## TurboTechRacing (Nov 3, 2010)

Those that have the Injen intake and look inside the tube, will know you cannot just put a "tube" on your car (Hint: it is MUCH more than just a "round tube", other items are inside of it)... It is all about the proper air flow around the MAF sensor...


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## limited360 (May 6, 2011)

TurboTechRacing said:


> Those that have the Injen intake and look inside the tube, will know you cannot just put a "tube" on your car (Hint: it is MUCH more than just a "round tube", other items are inside of it)... It is all about the proper air flow around the MAF sensor...


absolutely!!! Its not as simple as it once was guys... the MAF signal is updating at 10HZ if not greater!!! Most likely 100HZ on a bad day!!! 

This is where people start running into issue with 'HOME BREW' modifications.


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

TurboTechRacing said:


> Those that have the Injen intake and look inside the tube, will know you cannot just put a "tube" on your car (Hint: it is MUCH more than just a "round tube", other items are inside of it)... It is all about the proper air flow around the MAF sensor...


Aaron's right. The ZZP intake has an aluminum "sleeve" on the inside of the intake tube (not sure what the Injen intake has?). In the instuctions it was very specific that if this "sleeve" was to be removed, the car wouldn't operate correctly.


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## Spaceme (Jan 20, 2011)

By the way, if you have the ZZP Intake, Vince at Trifecta can modify your tune to work with or without the aluminum spacer.


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## slecyk (Mar 12, 2011)

Spaceme said:


> By the way, if you have the ZZP Intake, Vince at Trifecta can modify your tune to work with or without the aluminum spacer.


What would be the point of removing it?


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## Orange (Mar 6, 2011)

Can someone tell me the model number of the K & N filter that comes with ZZP's intake tube? Also: does it need to be oiled or is it the dry type?


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## Dwnshft (May 16, 2011)

I don't believe K&N actually offer a dry filter.


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## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

tim18t said:


> I have a bridge I'd like to sell you.
> 
> There is one bend. Its the MAF housing size that matters most.


 
Not that simple as stated above by other users. The ID of the MAF housing is less important than the airflow across the sensor itself. As Limited360 stated a simple bend can change the air flow drastically.


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## Bama_Eco (May 5, 2011)

Any indication when the downpipe will be available? 

If I buy anything, its going to be in bulk. Intake, downpipe and midpipe...


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## tehcor (Mar 30, 2011)

downpipe is available i believe. midpipe can be made by any exhaust shop..its just a open cat.

i received a email back from them asking when the fmic is gonna be available and they said approx 2 months.


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## VictoryRed08 (Feb 16, 2011)

tehcor said:


> downpipe is available i believe. midpipe can be made by any exhaust shop..its just a open cat.
> 
> i received a email back from them asking when the fmic is gonna be available and they said approx 2 months.


ZZP has released the midpipe ( Cobalt & Ion ---> ZZ Performance ) and the downpipe (which I believe they are calling the o2 housing, no?) is set to come out soon.


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## tehcor (Mar 30, 2011)

VictoryRed08 said:


> ZZP has released the midpipe ( Cobalt & Ion ---> ZZ Performance ) and the downpipe (which I believe they are calling the o2 housing, no?) is set to come out soon.


oh you're right...i thought it was the downpipe they released.my bad lol.and ya a downpipe is a o2 housing..its where your precat o2 sensor goes.


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## cj10918 (Jun 14, 2011)

I ordered the ZZP intake earlier this week and much to my suprise it arived by Friday....after installing all I can say is wow....the throttle response feels how it should be stock and the sound of the turbo is music to the ears......excellent job ZZP!!


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