# The Cruze's "True" Redline!



## prince_bigd (Jul 16, 2013)

Easy answer is NO. These arent race motors. With overrevs your biggest worry is going to be valvetrain issues. Failed valve spring leads to bent valve leads to major engine repairs. That being said most modern engines can handle the occasional overrev. I dont know about the 1.8 but in my trifecta tuned 2.2 ecotec I had it set to 7k rpm from the stock 6300.


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## obermd (Mar 3, 2012)

This is definitely going to shorten the life of your engine/transmission combo. Even race cars that have engines and transmissions designed for this and babied between races have problems doing this. The Cruze's transmission simply isn't designed to take this much delta torque from the engine. At a minimum plan on changing your ATF every oil change (or sooner) if you do this on a regular basis. Yes, the car can handle the occasional red line but the torque on the transmission is built up over time and not applied all at once.


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## giantsnation (Oct 11, 2012)

Realistically its not too bad assuming you don't do it every time you drive. Pointless, yes. The Cruze bottoms out after ~4500RPM so reving it further doesn't do you any favors regardless of if you have a tune or not.


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## 30 Ounce (Nov 18, 2012)

It would be nice to have the peak HP around the 6300 rpm range. I think the stock turbo doesn't flow enough air to sustain that. It signs off after 5000 and reving much past that is futile unless it puts the next gear change at the tourque peak or just below it. It does have a rev limiter @ 6700, fuel or spark cut, I'm not sure, but I know it's there because I've hit it a few times. So unless trifecta removed it rev to your hearts content.

As far as these not being race motors they actually have very high output per liter ratio. Actually more than a lot of race motors.


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

That poor transmission...


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## obermd (Mar 3, 2012)

It's not the engine block I'd be concerned about. It's the sudden high torque demands on the transmission that will cause the problems.


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## daktah (Mar 17, 2013)

obermd said:


> This is definitely going to shorten the life of your engine/transmission combo. Even race cars that have engines and transmissions designed for this and babied between races have problems doing this. The Cruze's transmission simply isn't designed to take this much delta torque from the engine. At a minimum plan on changing your ATF every oil change (or sooner) if you do this on a regular basis. Yes, the car can handle the occasional red line but the torque on the transmission is built up over time and not applied all at once.


Yeah that was like 3rd time doing it in the ~20000 miles Ive had the car tuned and I dont think Im going to be doing it many more times, I just got bored and felt like posting it.



giantsnation said:


> Realistically its not too bad assuming you don't do it every time you drive. Pointless, yes. The Cruze bottoms out after ~4500RPM so reving it further doesn't do you any favors regardless of if you have a tune or not.


I only mentioned the tune because normally you can only rev to 4000 in park/neutral but I had that changed to 6500 (200-300 below cutoff RPM) with the tune, I didnt mean it gave me a bigger powerband or anything.



jblackburn said:


> That poor transmission...


Dont worry, its done its job and now can live the rest of its life in relative peace below 6500 RPM.


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## brian v (Dec 25, 2011)

Do it again until it explodes and throws smoke all over your face we need a laugh .


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## Robby (Mar 1, 2013)

I'm slow I guess, but finally picked up on the fact you are performing a 'Nuetral Drop'

So, we have a transmission with all its internals not under load (in nuetral) as well as the halfshafts and c/v joints.
You then wind the engine up to + 4000 rpm and then drop it into drive.....right?
There is no design criteria for something like that in a hydraulic transmission.......frankly, it doesn't do much good for a manual either, but jeez!
I have seen trans cases split in two (or more) from that kind of ham handed handling......abuse of the highest order.

I hope you really are serious that you will not perform that feat in the future......for anyone.

Should you scatter the trans the event will be recorded in the ecm......it has already recorded maximum rpm achieved....you can drop your powertrain warranty into a shredder.

Don't do that anymore, OK?
Rob


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## Merc6 (Jun 8, 2013)

Now that I also noticed he's dropping N bombs on the move, yeah that's not healthy even if you added motor home trans coolers with fans. Just down shift as far as it lets you and feather the throttle till you need to get up and go. 


Slightly unrelated. In the manual I noticed a 4k rev limiter when sitting still in neutral but while moving in neutral the limiter is redline. 


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## iKermit (Dec 13, 2010)

Well this thread backfired quick

 -I'm mobile-


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## sx sonic (Nov 25, 2013)

An occasional, brief bump of the rev limiter is not going to adversely damage the engine, it's not healthy and should be avoided but it's not the end of the world. Doing it in neutral with no load on the engine is also harder on the engine than under a load, kinda like throwing a haymaker and not connecting with anything vs connecting that haymaker with a target.


Neutral drops on the otherhand are damaging and should be avoided at all cost, there's also no reason for doing one...... except 2 fast 2 furious


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## brian v (Dec 25, 2011)

But we really want to see it do it some more . Come on do it do it again .


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## daktah (Mar 17, 2013)

This makes me wonder, why do manufacturers bother putting numbers above the car's redline? The Cruze doesnt even hit 7000 but the tach goes up to 8000.


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## WhiteAndBright (Mar 4, 2013)

Its a 1.4L that is 138hp stock.. If you wanted a race car you should have bought a race car.. Smh..


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## Merc6 (Jun 8, 2013)

daktah said:


> This makes me wonder, why do manufacturers bother putting numbers above the car's redline? The Cruze doesnt even hit 7000 but the tach goes up to 8000.


For ricer sales reasons. Only Hondas and a few Mazdas actually use the full tack on normal Joe Schmoe cars. Same for 180 MPH speedos on street cars when the car with governor removed will most likely crash into someone or something before you bury the needle. Best tach IMHO is the Skittle SRT-4 at night, they have a shaded area for redline. It actually looks better in person than the pic posted below.


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## obermd (Mar 3, 2012)

daktah said:


> This makes me wonder, why do manufacturers bother putting numbers above the car's redline? The Cruze doesnt even hit 7000 but the tach goes up to 8000.


Tradition.


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## brian v (Dec 25, 2011)

No that is to let you know where you can not GO .
Open up those intake ports and you'll redline , although you just might have to increase your fuel rail a bit and injector size .


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## sx sonic (Nov 25, 2013)

brian v said:


> No that is to let you know where you can not GO .
> Open up those intake ports and you'll redline , although you just might have to increase your fuel rail a bit and injector size .


Gonna need boost before the stock 1.8 injectors get maxed out.

Also curiously enough the injector duty cycle is lower near redline than it is at peak torque, upping the redline isn't as taxing on fuel requirements.


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## 99_XC600 (Feb 24, 2013)

That is not optimum fuel savings.......


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## Blue Angel (Feb 18, 2011)

I'm not really sure how bad it is...

Engine - no worries. Reving it to the limiter is no big deal, it's designed to do that. I wouldn't do it until the oil and coolant are up to temp, but other than that you're not forcing the engine to do anything it wasn't designed to do. GM's torture testing is pretty thorough.

Transmission - not 100% sure, but 90% positive they have this stuff in mind when setting up all the protection on the car. Case in point, by buddy's rented Grand Prix many years ago. It was a ~2002 GP with the 3.1L Auto and he tried to do a neutral drop from a stop. The engine would only rev to around 4k RPM, and when te transmission was shifted from N to D the engine bogged right down to less than 2k RPM and then did a real soft "lurch" into gear. He was disappointed that GM Engineering saw him coming and he couldn't get the tires smoking.

I bet something similar is happening with the Cruze auto... I doubt it's actually slamming into gear, but dropping engine torque and RPM before engaging.

Having said all that, doing such things is definitely not going to lengthen the transmission's lifespan. If you like your car I would avoid such things.


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## 70AARCUDA (Nov 14, 2010)

...the "true" redline is about 1 rpm and 1 microsecond just *before* the engine *BLOWS-UP*.


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## Merc6 (Jun 8, 2013)

Blue Angel said:


> I'm not really sure how bad it is...
> 
> Engine - no worries. Reving it to the limiter is no big deal, it's designed to do that. I wouldn't do it until the oil and coolant are up to temp, but other than that you're not forcing the engine to do anything it wasn't designed to do. GM's torture testing is pretty thorough.
> 
> ...


Another thing they did was reverse while going foreword. Going from drive to reverse on the freeway just puts the car in neutral and turns on reverse lights freaking out the person behind you. I wouldn't try it out in the event it doesn't work the same in other cars and trucks. 

I take it manuals won't let you. I already have fun trying to achieve 2nd to 3rd gear or 1st w/o coming to a stop so I doubt it would work out going to reverse. 


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## jblackburn (Apr 14, 2012)

Merc6 said:


> Another thing they did was reverse while going foreword. Going from drive to reverse on the freeway just puts the car in neutral and turns on reverse lights freaking out the person behind you. I wouldn't try it out in the event it doesn't work the same in other cars and trucks.
> 
> I take it manuals won't let you. I already have fun trying to achieve 2nd to 3rd gear or 1st w/o coming to a stop so I doubt it would work out going to reverse.
> 
> ...


Reverse has a synchro in this transmission. You can be rolling forward slightly and engage reverse - I do it all the time at very low speeds going to back into a space or parallel parking. If you did it at high speeds and dropped the clutch on it, it would probably just blow up the transmission or toast the clutch. That's why there's a reverse lockout collar. 

If you've ever driven a Honda MT, you'll know that you can't put one into R while moving forward even half a mile an hour. It just grinds and doesn't go in til you're at a complete stop. That is also by design. 




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## Merc6 (Jun 8, 2013)

jblackburn said:


> Reverse has a synchro in this transmission. You can be rolling forward slightly and engage reverse - I do it all the time at very low speeds going to back into a space or parallel parking. If you did it at high speeds and dropped the clutch on it, it would probably just blow up the transmission or toast the clutch. That's why there's a reverse lockout collar.
> 
> If you've ever driven a Honda MT, you'll know that you can put one into R while moving forward even half a mile an hour. It just grinds and doesn't go in til you're at a complete stop. That is also by design.
> 
> ...


Guess I need to swap fluids and see if it gets better. I can't go reverse or 1st while still moving. 


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## sx sonic (Nov 25, 2013)

Merc6 said:


> Guess I need to swap fluids and see if it gets better. I can't go reverse or 1st while still moving.
> 
> 
> Sent from AutoGuide.com App


That definitely sounds like fluid. When I was running Lucas 75w-90 R-1-2 weren't ideal to get into moving and terrible in cold weather. The Amsoil syncromesh is a little better cold than the Lucas stuff was warm. and


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## Quadrajet (Nov 22, 2013)

daktah said:


> With a Trifecta tune to remove the neutral 4000 RPM limit, you get to about 45 or so , drop to neutral, floor it to 6000-6500 and without lifting your foot put it into drive. If you did it right your needle will bounce like you're playing Need For Speed! *Yay totally worth it just for that and nothing else!*
> Not recommended for obvious reasons (See: Exploding Engines).
> 
> 
> ...


No, No, No, thats not bad for your engine at all.
But next time, be sure to drain the oil out to get the biggest bang for your buck.


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