# Hacking the Onstar system



## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

Just a warning to our fellow users. Hacking of the ONStar system *will void your entire vehicle warranty*. This is due to the integration of ONstar with the cars CAN bus sytem which all systems communicate on. 

Besides that have at it!


----------



## NBrehm (Jun 27, 2011)

Can I ask why you would do this and risk f'ing up your whole car as supposed to, I don't know, dropping a couple bucks on a GPS


----------



## cruzeman (Mar 13, 2011)

i think he wants to use onstars connection to give him free internet for his ipad... totally not worth it!!


----------



## shawn672 (Oct 31, 2010)

cruzeman said:


> i think he wants to use onstars connection to give him free internet for his ipad... totally not worth it!!


Not free internet, free GPS


----------



## cruzeman (Mar 13, 2011)

If that's the case its even worse!


----------



## ben.will.mill (Jun 18, 2011)

hfirst of all. i'm not "hacking" the onstar service or system in ANY way. I probably should have titled this thread something else like.. repurposing the useless onstar module. 

Just adding a 30 pin out from the onstar module to receive gps signal. Not free internet. i bet that would be completely impossible.


----------



## Mikesus (Aug 4, 2011)

Umm, save yourself warranty issues and buy this: 

Amazon.com: Bad Elf GPS Receiver for iPod touch, iPhone, iPad and iPad2 (66-channel, SBAS/WAAS, 10Hz): Electronics

Or better yet, sell the iPad you have, and buy the 3g version... It has a BUILT in GPS...


----------



## ben.will.mill (Jun 18, 2011)

yeah.. but just going and buying something has no appeal to me. i'd rather do it my self. and i kinda want to disable onstar completely. call me crazy but i don't
love that my car can be tracked


----------



## scaredpoet (Nov 29, 2010)

ben.will.mill said:


> yeah.. but just going and buying something has no appeal to me.



But risking trashing your $15,000+ brand new car and voiding its warranty _is_ appealing to you?

:uhh:


Okay... whatever floats your boat!

I just think there are plenty of less-risky, less expensive things to "repurpose," is all.

Also consider that even if you get a 30-pin out, it's still gotta talk to your iPad, which the OnStar module may lack the ability to do easily. Maybe with the right app.


----------



## bartonmd (Jun 30, 2011)

I could see it voiding your ECM and other connected electrical warranty, but if you haven't messed with the powertrain tune, there is no way that your mechanical warranty on most anything is void... They may try and say it is at the dealer, but going up the chain, or taking them to arbitration will sort it out. 

The burden is on them to PROVE that what you did messed up whatever broke, before they can legally void your warranty on that part...

I'm not saying that this particular thing is a good idea, or wise, or anything, but it will not void your whole vehicle warranty.

Mike


----------



## Mikesus (Aug 4, 2011)

True, the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act of 1975 says it does not void your whole warranty, but what the dealer says might be something completely different, and the only way to "enforce" your rights would be with an attorney. (and despite what you see on TV, they don't pick up cases like this for free) SO, if you are still inclined, have at it. Or pay $99 and get one that is KNOWN to work...


----------



## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

^ Yes burden of proof is always on GM for any modification. However the reason it may void your power train warranty is because all of your sensors apart of the power train are still connected to the CAN system. Which means if the dealer really wanted to they could deny a warranty claim. Everything is on the CAN Bus now in days which means it's up for questioning by the dealer.


----------



## Mikesus (Aug 4, 2011)

JDM-USDM Love said:


> ^ Yes burden of proof is always on GM for any modification. However the reason it may void your power train warranty is because all of your sensors apart of the power train are still connected to the CAN system. Which means if the dealer really wanted to they could deny a warranty claim. Everything is on the CAN Bus now in days which means it's up for questioning by the dealer.



Exactly. That is why I don't use cheap OBD devices, and if the dealer says whatever you did is what caused the damage, its now on you to prove it didn't.


----------



## NBrehm (Jun 27, 2011)

I def would not mess with anything in the CAN system, especially with a powered item like an IPAD, a little voltage in the wrong place can be catastrophic to the whole system. You're call but an awful lot of risk


----------



## bartonmd (Jun 30, 2011)

JDM-USDM Love said:


> ^ Yes burden of proof is always on GM for any modification. However the reason it may void your power train warranty is because all of your sensors apart of the power train are still connected to the CAN system. Which means if the dealer really wanted to they could deny a warranty claim. Everything is on the CAN Bus now in days which means it's up for questioning by the dealer.


The dealer could deny it, but that doesn't mean they're right, or legal... I could see them denying it for a blown up ECM or something, but not for a pitched rod, or a blown up CV joint...

Mike


----------



## ben.will.mill (Jun 18, 2011)

wow. people are just so sure that i will ruin my car and void the warrantee.. what ever. i'm peacin out of this forum.. thanks for all your "help"


----------



## boats4life (May 28, 2011)

ben.will.mill said:


> wow. people are just so sure that i will ruin my car and void the warrantee.. what ever. i'm peacin out of this forum.. thanks for all your "help"


We're not trying to bash on you, but they're right. An easier way to do this (and cheaper) is if you already own an iPhone as well as your wifi iPad. If both are jailbroken, you can share the gps feed from your iPhone via Bluetooth. As for your car being tracked, thats a personal choice, but I'd stick with it. You could always just unplug the module until you decide to sell, no harm no foul. Then the next owner can still use the system without worrying. No ones doubting your skills, but NBrehm is also right about stray voltage. That could kill your whole car, potentially.


----------



## NBrehm (Jun 27, 2011)

I'm not doubting your ability to do it, I'm just trying to make sure you know the dangers of doing it. There are alot of systems that run back to CAN and it would suck to fire up your IPAD and deploy all your airbags. Not 100% sure that would be possible but I am also not 100% sure it wouldn't, I am willing to bet they hook to the CAN system somewhere. But added voltage even if it doesn't do damage can cause all of your sensors to read wrong and that can cause engine and transmission damage. If you really want to do it have it and lmk how it goes, I think it is a cool idea, just as long as you know what might happen.


----------



## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

bartonmd said:


> The dealer could deny it, but that doesn't mean they're right, or legal... I could see them denying it for a blown up ECM or something, but not for a pitched rod, or a blown up CV joint...
> 
> Mike


A blown CV joint. No. The point still remains the same though. Anything connected to the CAN Bus is up for questioning by the dealer. If they've voided people's warranty for racing a car within it's set limits then why wouldn't they look for another reason to save more money?


Also to the OP. Just do it. Get back with us and let us know how it goes. It's your car. No one is trying to bash you but in an open forum like this you'll get many different opinions. No one saying it's not an interesting idea or anything. They are just weighing on what they see the risks vs rewards are. Good luck!

ccasion14:


----------



## NBrehm (Jun 27, 2011)

JDM-USDM Love said:


> Also to the OP. Just do it. Get back with us and let us know how it goes. It's your car. No one is trying to bash you but in an open forum like this you'll get many different opinions. No one saying it's not an interesting idea or anything. They are just weighing on what they see the risks vs rewards are. Good luck!
> 
> ccasion14:


well said!


----------



## jbac67 (Oct 12, 2011)

Don't be stupid :uhh:


----------



## Sparkles (Jul 3, 2011)

Little too late. I applaud the thinking outside the box, but for every 1 good idea, there's a thousand bad ones. This falls into the latter.


----------



## ben.will.mill (Jun 18, 2011)

Ok. For all you people who thought it impossible.. I have successfully disabled my onstar system (on purpose), found how to plug a 30pin connected up to the gps system.. And thanks to my developer account with apple I was able to write an app that integrates it with the iPad maps app. It works beautifully and only cost about 30 dollars. (and about 2 hours of work). I don't understand why everyone hates the idea and I really don't care. I have something you don't have, and I am proud of it


----------



## cruzeman (Mar 13, 2011)

very cool


----------



## limited360 (May 6, 2011)

ben.will.mill said:


> Ok. For all you people who thought it impossible.. I have successfully disabled my onstar system (on purpose), found how to plug a 30pin connected up to the gps system.. And thanks to my developer account with apple I was able to write an app that integrates it with the iPad maps app. It works beautifully and only cost about 30 dollars. (and about 2 hours of work). I don't understand why everyone hates the idea and I really don't care. I have something you don't have, and I am proud of it


Sounds solid! Glad you took the initiative! So many people are negative...


----------



## SilverCruzer (Nov 30, 2010)

ben.will.mill said:


> Ok. For all you people who thought it impossible.. I have successfully disabled my onstar system (on purpose), found how to plug a 30pin connected up to the gps system.. And thanks to my developer account with apple I was able to write an app that integrates it with the iPad maps app. It works beautifully and only cost about 30 dollars. (and about 2 hours of work). I don't understand why everyone hates the idea and I really don't care. I have something you don't have, and I am proud of it


 The question I had at the beginning, and still have now that you are done: How did you disable the system AND still get use from it? What exactly is disabled? Obviously, the GPS function is still turned on.


----------



## Cruz3r (Jul 13, 2011)

Mikesus said:


> Umm, save yourself warranty issues and buy this:
> 
> Amazon.com: Bad Elf GPS Receiver for iPod touch, iPhone, iPad and iPad2 (66-channel, SBAS/WAAS, 10Hz): Electronics
> 
> Or better yet, sell the iPad you have, and buy the 3g version... It has a BUILT in GPS...


i know this was a long time ago but thanks mikesus im buying a Bad Elf!!


----------



## ben.will.mill (Jun 18, 2011)

SilverCruzer said:


> The question I had at the beginning, and still have now that you are done: How did you disable the system AND still get use from it? What exactly is disabled? Obviously, the GPS function is still turned on.


 I found the part in the onstar box that basically callsto onstar and de soldered it from the board.. I have no need for the onstar service an in light of the onstar tracking scandal I decided that would be the best thing to do. Since I basically destroyed the onstar box in my car I decided to repurpose it and put the gps part of the unit to good and legal use


----------



## got_boost (Sep 29, 2011)

ben.will.mill said:


> I found the part in the onstar box that basically callsto onstar and de soldered it from the board.. I have no need for the onstar service an in light of the onstar tracking scandal I decided that would be the best thing to do. Since I basically destroyed the onstar box in my car I decided to repurpose it and put the gps part of the unit to good and legal use


 You know in light of how everyone reacted to the T&C they decided not to continue with the data storing right? I canceled my account anyways though. I like this idea...might have to start ripping **** apart this weekend lol.


----------



## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

This thread is a rarity. Both debating parties points were validated. He did indeed make a working system *and* voided his warranty. Everyone wins.


Sent from my Autoguide iPhone app


----------



## ben.will.mill (Jun 18, 2011)

** also. Just out of curiosity. It talked to the local Chevy dealer who happens to be a great friend about this. He said that it is possible that it could void your warrantee if you did not have a certified shop do it. Since my brother owns a certified shop helped, no warrantee was voided. So to all of you - Use caution but if you are smart about it you won't get a voided warrantee.


----------



## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

ben.will.mill said:


> ** also. Just out of curiosity. It talked to the local Chevy dealer who happens to be a great friend about this. He said that it is possible that it could void your warrantee if you did not have a certified shop do it. Since my brother owns a certified shop helped, no warrantee was voided. So to all of you - Use caution but if you are smart about it you won't get a voided warrantee.


:/ a certified Tech helping you "destroy" your OnStar module does not save you from voiding your warrantee. That is not how it works.


Sent from my Autoguide iPhone app


----------



## ben.will.mill (Jun 18, 2011)

Well since the owner of the dealership says its okay.. Then it's okay for me. I trust the guy as he is on the Chevy board of directors


----------



## boats4life (May 28, 2011)

ben.will.mill said:


> Well since the owner of the dealership says its okay.. Then it's okay for me. I trust the guy as he is on the Chevy board of directors


After going through recruiters and inproccessing into the military, I personally get EVERYTHING in writing... Just sayin'.


----------



## David1 (Sep 16, 2011)

Mikesus said:


> True, the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act of 1975 says it does not void your whole warranty, but what the dealer says might be something completely different, and the only way to "enforce" your rights would be with an attorney. (and despite what you see on TV, they don't pick up cases like this for free) SO, if you are still inclined, have at it. Or pay $99 and get one that is KNOWN to work...


This does not apply if you modify the vehical from the original specifications or intention.


----------



## ben.will.mill (Jun 18, 2011)

... did i ever say i trashed it? 
Money is not an issue to me right now. I'm a 22 year old business owner and make about 75k a year. With that said, I am fine repurposing and risking it. for all of you out there.. i 100% understand the consequences and i feel like i learned a lot in the process.
scared poet - as stated previously, I developed an app for the 30 pin our module to communicate with the iPad. I am working on getting it through to the app store and will provide this app for free. and yes.. this was appealing to me. and yes. it did float my boat.


----------



## limited360 (May 6, 2011)

ben.will.mill said:


> ... did i ever say i trashed it?
> Money is not an issue to me right now. I'm a 22 year old business owner and make about 75k a year. With that said, I am fine repurposing and risking it. for all of you out there.. i 100% understand the consequences and i feel like i learned a lot in the process.
> scared poet - as stated previously, I developed an app for the 30 pin our module to communicate with the iPad. I am working on getting it through to the app store and will provide this app for free. and yes.. this was appealing to me. and yes. it did float my boat.


Good words mate.... 

Some people don't understand circuitry and how easy it is to manipulate somethings if you know what you are doing.


----------



## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

ben.will.mill said:


> ... did i ever say i trashed it?


.... 



ben.will.mill said:


> Since I basically destroyed the onstar box in my car


That's good that you can mod your car to this extent and not worry about the consequences. But brushing it aside like there are none is another. Not everyone here understands just what those consequences are.






Sent from my Autoguide iPhone app


----------



## ben.will.mill (Jun 18, 2011)

Who doesn't understand the consequences? I had the balls to rip in to my car. Yes I did destroy onstar, which in my opinion is a useless service. But I didn't trash my entire car


----------



## iKermit (Dec 13, 2010)

limited360 said:


> Good words mate....
> 
> Some people don't understand circuitry and how easy it is to manipulate somethings if you know what you are doing.


I work for an electronic component distributor (along with all equipment and cables) so i can second that lol. All day i hear all types of projects people are doing and they are crazier to say the least.


----------



## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

ben.will.mill said:


> Who doesn't understand the consequences? I had the balls to rip in to my car. Yes I did destroy onstar, which in my opinion is a useless service. But I didn't trash my entire car


The OnStar module is directly tied into the cars CAN BUS. It's resistance sensitive which means the soldering you did is grounds for warranty denial let alone "destroying" the OnStar module which is *VIN specific*, which means only a dealer can tie a replacement to your vehicle. There are no more VIN learning procedures for modules for a user to do second hand. Hopefully absolutely nothing is denied because it is a great idea for those that have the means. I personally hate OnStar. I just don't want new guys thinking this is a safe modification to do especially if they're not in your shoes, know what I mean?




Sent from my Autoguide iPhone app


----------



## ben.will.mill (Jun 18, 2011)

If they attempt to do it it is in no way my problem.
I realize your trying to prove your point that it's "bad". Aeroscout977, but we don't have to agree with you. Just cause you have the "super moderator" title next to your name does not mean me have to bow down and follow everything you say.
I realize what I did could potentially give me problems but.. The outcome far outweighs the negative.. In my opinion.


----------



## Aeroscout977 (Nov 25, 2010)

ben.will.mill said:


> If they attempt to do it it is in no way my problem.
> I realize your trying to prove your point that it's "bad". Aeroscout977, but we don't have to agree with you. Just cause you have the "super moderator" title next to your name does not mean me have to bow down and follow everything you say.
> I realize what I did could potentially give me problems but.. The outcome far outweighs the negative.. In my opinion.


Where has my title been employed anywhere in this debate? If you've run out of counter points then that's fine just say so. No need to resort to name calling at this point. I've Even said its a good idea. So please keep your comments civil as I have.

Sent from my Autoguide iPhone app


----------



## ben.will.mill (Jun 18, 2011)

The know it all attitude says it all. 6 months ago I left this forum because of jackasses like you. I'm leaving again


----------



## limited360 (May 6, 2011)

ben.will.mill said:


> The know it all attitude says it all. 6 months ago I left this forum because of jackasses like you. I'm leaving again



Now that wasn't all to nice to say... Sorry your leaving. I thought you were a good addition for your technical background.


----------



## Sparkles (Jul 3, 2011)

ben.will.mill said:


> ... did i ever say i trashed it?


 Uhh...Yes?


ben.will.mill said:


> Since I basically destroyed the onstar box in my car I decided to repurpose it and put the gps part of the unit to good and legal use


----------

